[chadwarden]

I'm not that experienced and am not very good and listening to the sound and reading the puddle to gauge what volts I'm running so I'm seeing if there is any way to figure out what volts you're on when using MIG welders that have dials with meaningless numbers. No, I don't have the manual for the machine and I don't think many workshops have the manual for their MIG welders. I'm asking this because I am very fussy about the voltage I use for out of position welds like vertical up (exactly 19 for vertical up). Should I just set the wire speed first and then work out my voltage? Any other ideas? Thanks in advance.

[Ranger]

The old school way requires experence but you want information without giving us information like system specs or model # in order to help us help you... If you really want to know the voltage the add a cheap voltage meter display from ebay and wire it up ....

[Otto Nobedder]

You can determine your Open Circuit Voltage (OCV), which is how MIGS are set (being constant-voltage machines) by opening the wire-feed clamp, turning off the gas, squeezing the trigger, and measuring the voltage (ideally between your tip and the table) with a good digital voltmeter. Adjust to your preferred volts for each process, and use a scribe to make a fine match-line between the knob indicator and the panel, and label each mark with a sharpie. Then test the accuracy by returning to each mark and re-checking the voltage.

You should be able, with clean, crisp scribe marks, to return to within 0.2V of each setting with ease.

Two cents...

Steve S

[AnvilJack]

First, thank you for posting the procedure for testing the open circuit voltage. I will try this out very shortly (few jobs on the go I really must enjoy first).

Next, why do the welder manufacturers not provide this information? The Hobart Ironman manual has terrific information I would love to see as a standard. Lincoln will not tell me anything about the volts delivered at each number on my 180C PowerMig (Yes, I have asked). And I have very only the most basic information from the manufacturer of my other MIG welder.

Third, how important is it to know the voltages? As you can tell from my last paragraph, I don't know, on my usual welder. When I was learning, I was taught to set the amps through knowing the thickness of steel (required amps), wire size, (to choose appropriate burn off factor), wire burn-off factor, (amps delivered at arc when multiplied by wire speed), and wire speed. (I would give a detailed step by step example if anyone wanted to try this: here I just outline the process.) With this information we can calculate the amps for a specific wire speed number on the welder, using one specific size of wire. Set this speed for the work at hand, hold the gun on the work, press the trigger, and select voltage by adjusting for the best sizzle.The only fine tuning is done with the wire speed (amps). For many welding machines with rocker switches or taking their volts from taps on the transformer, I wonder if this isn't enough.

With my welder with continuous adjustment of the voltages, I only back off the voltage if I am getting a lot of melt through, since I have concluded that (if I my travel speed is not too slow, and the stick-out is about 12 mm, and gun angle(s) adjustment doesn't stop the burn through) that the voltage is a touch too high. So, basically, I use the settings for wire speed and volts from the suggested chart, and fine tune with the gun adjustments first, wire speed second, and sometimes (rarely) have to change the volts. (You can use the process I hinted at above to work out your own "suggested chart" for your welder.)

So, I ask again, how important is it know the volts?

This whole topic of "how to set up your specific welder" is one that vexes many beginners, most of whom do not have a machine with the table of suggested settings (cheaper machines). Ironically, experienced welders, who do not need the chart of suggestions, and who are bored by the whole topic, have them as decals in their more expensive machines, or have Millers, for example, with the associated calculators, apps, etc.

[Otto Nobedder]

I suppose the short form is, knowing roughly what each knob means in a certain position gives a starting point.

I, too, go by ear and eye, but I always start from a known set of parameters to get me in the ballpark.

Steve S

[MinnesotaDave]

I'm not that experienced and am not very good and listening to the sound and reading the puddle to gauge what volts I'm running so I'm seeing if there is any way to figure out what volts you're on when using MIG welders that have dials with meaningless numbers. No, I don't have the manual for the machine and I don't think many workshops have the manual for their MIG welders. I'm asking this because I am very fussy about the voltage I use for out of position welds like vertical up (exactly 19 for vertical up). Should I just set the wire speed first and then work out my voltage? Any other ideas? Thanks in advance.

If I want to match a particular setting I clip my meter leads to the studs under the door.

The OCV does not mean anything really on my Miller 210. For example:
On tap 3 the OCV is 23.2 volts
Welding voltage is 18.2 on wire "speed" 30 and 17.5 on "speed" 40

On tap 4 the OCV is 26 volts
Welding voltage is 18.8 on wire "speed" 48.

I did not write down the inches per minute in this case. Running .035 and 75/25 gas.

[Otto Nobedder]

When measuring voltage across the posts while welding, your voltmeter is part of a voltage-divider network in parallel with the arc. This makes the voltage reading relative to actual welding current, which can be usefull. Note that welding current (measured voltage) is affected not only by wire speed but by stick-out as well, and the meter is difficult to monitor while actually welding.

Since the reading is affected both by initial OCV setting AND wire speed, it's not very useful as a "starting point", particualrly against the recommendation charts, most of which give an initial voltage and a wire speed. Jody has a video, BTW, on establishing wire speeds and marking them on your dial.

Steve S

[MinnesotaDave]

When measuring voltage across the posts while welding, your voltmeter is part of a voltage-divider network in parallel with the arc. This makes the voltage reading relative to actual welding current, which can be usefull. Note that welding current (measured voltage) is affected not only by wire speed but by stick-out as well, and the meter is difficult to monitor while actually welding.

Since the reading is affected both by initial OCV setting AND wire speed, it's not very useful as a "starting point", particualrly against the recommendation charts, most of which give an initial voltage and a wire speed. Jody has a video, BTW, on establishing wire speeds and marking them on your dial.

Steve S

I think we're saying the same thing. The welding voltage is what is important when comparing to something like a miller online calculator or a specific setting from another welder. But I normally just start at the door chart and adjust as needed.

The wire speeds are easy to count out, I'm just lazy with my machine since I already know how I like it set

[Otto Nobedder]

When measuring voltage across the posts while welding, your voltmeter is part of a voltage-divider network in parallel with the arc. This makes the voltage reading relative to actual welding current, which can be usefull. Note that welding current (measured voltage) is affected not only by wire speed but by stick-out as well, and the meter is difficult to monitor while actually welding.

Since the reading is affected both by initial OCV setting AND wire speed, it's not very useful as a "starting point", particualrly against the recommendation charts, most of which give an initial voltage and a wire speed. Jody has a video, BTW, on establishing wire speeds and marking them on your dial.

Steve S

I think we're saying the same thing. The welding voltage is what is important when comparing to something like a miller online calculator or a specific setting from another welder. But I normally just start at the door chart and adjust as needed.

The wire speeds are easy to count out, I'm just lazy with my machine since I already know how I like it set

I think so, too. My impression was Chad was looking for that starting point to set his wire speed from, and OCV seemed the best point, since on a digital machine like a Miller 252, it's the OCV you set at the panel. Welding votage can be read at the panel, as well, but is hard to watch unless you set up some scrap you can weld without watching the puddle. That is a good way to get a consistent welding current, though.

Steve S

[AnvilJack]

So, I ask again, "How important is it to know the volts?"

People are out there reading this forum: I received an email:

Lincoln Electric PowerMig 180C Voltage Settings

Thank you for your inquiry through our website and the opportunity to assist you with your concern.

The open circuit voltage for each position will depend on the input voltage.

This is a CV machine but the voltage will drop with a load on each tap.

For the voltage range switch the Open Circuit Voltage should be about

A--10.5 Volts DC,
B--12,
C--15,
D--18,
E--20.5,
F--23,
G--25.5,
H--28,
I--31,
J--34.

Brilliant. Thank you, Lincoln Electric.

I am surprised at the voltage range. My other welder, a 150 amp MIG, has a range from 15 volts to 19.5 volts.

Let me digest this information before I comment further.

But, again, thank you, Lincoln Electric.

[weldin mike 27]

http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/forum/show ... php?t=7746 remember that ocv is higher that actual welding voltage, as this link points out.

[Millerismyname]

How do I get the same reference settings for my millermatic 212 as you did for your lincoln?

[AnvilJack]

If you are referring to the data for my Lincoln 180C, I sent them an email, (twice, if I recall correctly), and after I mentioned something about it on this forum, they (Lincoln) replied.

I posted the data on the forum because several other people have been asking the same question, on YouTube, in particular.