[bosulli]

Trying out duel shield flux to replace stick for fab'n up agricultural implements. Watched Jody's video(s), and he got virtually no splatter. Watched Chucke2009's video with guest Stephen, and Stephen says one of the benefits of dual shield is low splatter.

I am getting BB's from hell, and they don't knock off easy. Material is .125 rectangle tube in flat position. Machine is an Everlast Power Mig 215. Running .035 wire from HTP (E71T-11). Volts 20.5, 220 ipm. Gas - C25 @ 25. From the videos and a Miller chart, settings are right. Seems the setting are hot, and not putting down a lot of material. Tried other settings, and splatter was always the same, bad.

Can't find much on dual shield on the interweb, so any of the expert advice that I always get from WT&T.com would be helpful.

[MinnesotaDave]

Are you on the correct polarity?

71t-11 is not dual shield that I know of.

Run it Direct Current Electrode Negative (DCEN).
This is the opposite of solid wire mig.

Do not use shielding gas with 71t-11, it is self-shielded wire.

[bosulli]

According to Jody in his You Tube video - "Dual Shield Flux Core Welding Basics" he specifies DCEP. Also, he specifies 71t-11, and refers to the Lincoln arc welding handbook, and in the dual shield section points out the 71t-11 class. So, that is what I used.

[Farmwelding]

Dual shield flux core is the same as short circuit mig welding. Self-shielded flux core is DCEN. I reccomend you watch Jodys video entitled he schooled me with andrew cardin. You may want to try to increase your wire feed speed which doesnt make sense, but watch the video. I also searched your wire type and it is a shelf shielded fluxcore wire so it requires no gas and is run on DCEN. Maybe you should share a picture of your wire and the spatter just to have a visual.

[PeteM]

I took a quick look at HTP and there wasn't any dual shield offered.

Also, the flux cored wires need more arc length, so maybe bump up that voltage to 22 or so, and have about 3/4 inch stick out. Flux core is generally pretty hot, but shouldn't be too crazy at those parameters, so be ready for that.

[Farmwelding]

I took a quick look at HTP and there wasn't any dual shield offered.

Also, the flux cored wires need more arc length, so maybe bump up that voltage to 22 or so, and have about 3/4 inch stick out. Flux core is generally pretty hot, but shouldn't be too crazy at those parameters, so be ready for that.

Yup just checked and HTP only sells self shielded flux core wire. If ypu want to do dual shield I would look at a Lincoln welder.

[MinnesotaDave]

According to Jody in his You Tube video - "Dual Shield Flux Core Welding Basics" he specifies DCEP. Also, he specifies 71t-11, and refers to the Lincoln arc welding handbook, and in the dual shield section points out the 71t-11 class. So, that is what I used.

His video is on 71t-1 which is dual shield DCEP

You bought 71t-11 which is shelf shielded, no gas, DCEN

Screenshot_2017-02-02-16-10-03.png (435.47 KiB) Viewed 2866 times

[Farmwelding]

Just like everything else in life somebody has to come along and make a bunch of fancy terms and numbers for everything. I get it, but you would think they would make it easier for those who actually have to use it.

[bosulli]

Oh, I did not notice the diff between 71t-1 & 71t-11. Since that is all HTP sold, I assumed there was not flux core wire for both gas shielded and and non-gas shielded. I will look for the Lincoln wire.

Thanks,

[MinnesotaDave]

While you're looking, go ahead and switch polarity and run the flux core - it works very well.

[PeteM]

Just like everything else in life somebody has to come along and make a bunch of fancy terms and numbers for everything. I get it, but you would think they would make it easier for those who actually have to use it.

It's not so bad. A lot of shops will go with one size/type of hard wire, one size/type of flux core, etc. to keep it simple. A place I welded at as a temp was nuts. 100% trace ability, with wire specified by the customer for all processes. If you didn't read the w.p.s. before you started welding and do exactly as instructed, including weighing the spool before and after use plus total weight used-

You were fired immediately. Take off your hood, clean up your tools and leave-fired.

[MinnesotaDave]

Just like everything else in life somebody has to come along and make a bunch of fancy terms and numbers for everything. I get it, but you would think they would make it easier for those who actually have to use it.

I'm not sure where you're coming from actually. Every profession has technical information to learn and becomes second nature after a while. With all the different types of materials that get welded, there are a lot of terms and specifications that are needed just to name everything in a standardized way.

[bosulli]

I will MinnasotaDave. Was hoping the dual shield would allow for 7018 like welds for short run and out of position runs fab'n tractor implements. What I am working on now is a forklift attachment for a front end loader on a Mahindra.

[MinnesotaDave]

I will MinnasotaDave. Was hoping the dual shield would allow for 7018 like welds for short run and out of position runs fab'n tractor implements. What I am working on now is a forklift attachment for a front end loader on a Mahindra.

Once you get the regular flux core dialed in I'm sure you'll be happy with the results.

It burns in nice and hot and doesn't really spatter that much. If it spatters a lot, the setting are not quite right.

Here are the Washington Alloy numbers I used on the last job.
Lincoln has a chart you can look at too.
I know the last time I asked HTP/usaweld where their parameters were listed, they didn't have any.

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[bosulli]

Thanks for the info. How does the penetration compare to stick (7018) and gas shielded MIG?

[MinnesotaDave]

Thanks for the info. How does the penetration compare to stick (7018) and gas shielded MIG?

Better than gas shielded mig, about the same as 7018 in my opinion.
But easier than stick for less than ideal body positions while trying to weld vertical and overhead.

You know what less than ideal is - all wedged up under some piece of junk broken hulk that needs to be welded one handed with your off hand but you can only see it with one eye closed

[Farmwelding]

Just remember you can always do multiple passes as long as you clean it and if you need to go vertical, don't you dare go downhill only uphill and you may have better results than mig. If you have slag inclusions than it is failed but it will come with time. And don't stick your head in the smoke plume.

[MinnesotaDave]

Just remember you can always do multiple passes as long as you clean it and if you need to go vertical, don't you dare go downhill only uphill and you may have better results than mig. If you have slag inclusions than it is failed but it will come with time. And don't stick your head in the smoke plume.

I would respectfully disagree about vertical down - run nice and hot, flux core runs down quite nicely

I do it with thin metal - like 1/8"

I like 6010/11 vertical down on thin stuff too - or to fill a gap before going vertical up.

[Farmwelding]

Wel MinnesotaDave I may be thinking dual shield. My teacher at my tech school, I only took one class so I'm no expert and have little experience with flux core but he said he'd kill any of us who ran flux core downhill. Or he may have been talking about it not being worth it since all they do is thick metal so you want a lot of penetration. I don't know but vertical uphill will give you a little more penetration anyway so I guess learn both.