The wire is bad because the wizard behind the curtain (our government) established "free trade" with China.
They are NOT held to ASME or ANSI standards in how they label the shit they sell us.
Somewhere I have a picture of a 1 1/2" ell, clearly marked "304", hanging from my pick-up magnet! That makes it a 400 series, at best. 304 is non-magnetic, unless worked, and then only slightly.
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Amen brother SteveOtto Nobedder wrote:The wire is bad because the wizard behind the curtain (our government) established "free trade" with China.
They are NOT held to ASME or ANSI standards in how they label the shit they sell us.
Be the monkey....
SOME ADDITIONAL DATA ON 304 & 316 MAGNETIC SUSCEPTIBILITY
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"...
Both 316 and 304 stainless steels are austenitic; when they cool, the iron remains in the form of austenite (gamma iron), a phase of iron which is nonmagnetic. The different phases of solid iron correspond to different crystal structures. In other alloys of steel, this high-temperature phase of iron transforms to a magnetic phase when the metal cools. The presence of nickel in the stainless steel alloys stabilizes austenite against this phase transition as the alloy cools to room temperature. As a result, a relative permeability of K ∼ 1.002 to 1.005 are typically reported for 304 and 316 stainless steels in their annealed state. This corresponds to a somewhat larger magnetic susceptibility than we might expect for other nonmagnetic materials, but is still well below what might be considered magnetic.
(...)
However, this does not mean that you should expect to measure such a low susceptibility on any item of 304 or 316 stainless steel that you encounter. For example, values of K∼1.8 have been found in randomly selected 304 SS fasteners. Any process which can change the crystal structure of stainless steel can cause austenite to be converted to the ferromagnetic martensite or ferrite forms of iron. These processes include cold working [AS MENTIONED BY OTTO NOBEDDER] and welding. It is also possible for austenite to spontaneously convert to martensite at low temperatures. To complicate matters further, the magnetic properties of these alloys depend on the alloy composition. Within the allowed ranges of variation of Ni and Cr, significant differences in magnetic properties may be observed for a given alloy.
(...)
What can be done to minimize the magnetization of stainless steel components? With its higher nickel composition range, 316 is considered the “most nonmagnetic” stainless steel. However, an item of 316 stainless steel which has significant welding or machining may be sufficiently magnetic to produce a noticeable attraction when brought near a magnet. “Ferrite free” welding rods are available to minimize the tendency of welds to become magnetic. In principle, a welded or machined component can be annealed to restore it to its nonmagnetic state, although this is not always convenient. Selecting a 316 stainless steel with nickel content that is in the upper side of the allowed content range may also be helpful, but again, may not always be practical. The 316N stainless steel alloy is expected to have less of a tendency to become magnetic than 316 or 316L, however, it may not be readily available.
(...)
Probing a 316 stainless steel weldment or machined structure with a magnet or a susceptibility meter can produce surprising results given that this alloy is considered nonmagnetic. A small deposit of ferrite in the weld on an outer vacuum vessel of a high field magnet is unlikely to be of concern. However, even a minute amount of ferromagnetic material is likely to be unacceptable in the sample holder of a nuclear magnetic resonance probe. This is a case where aluminum or copper should be employed for metal parts.
..."
source: http://www.mtm-inc.com/reduce_project_r ... ss_steels/
=====
Tanks for the patience.
Alexa
=====
"...
Both 316 and 304 stainless steels are austenitic; when they cool, the iron remains in the form of austenite (gamma iron), a phase of iron which is nonmagnetic. The different phases of solid iron correspond to different crystal structures. In other alloys of steel, this high-temperature phase of iron transforms to a magnetic phase when the metal cools. The presence of nickel in the stainless steel alloys stabilizes austenite against this phase transition as the alloy cools to room temperature. As a result, a relative permeability of K ∼ 1.002 to 1.005 are typically reported for 304 and 316 stainless steels in their annealed state. This corresponds to a somewhat larger magnetic susceptibility than we might expect for other nonmagnetic materials, but is still well below what might be considered magnetic.
(...)
However, this does not mean that you should expect to measure such a low susceptibility on any item of 304 or 316 stainless steel that you encounter. For example, values of K∼1.8 have been found in randomly selected 304 SS fasteners. Any process which can change the crystal structure of stainless steel can cause austenite to be converted to the ferromagnetic martensite or ferrite forms of iron. These processes include cold working [AS MENTIONED BY OTTO NOBEDDER] and welding. It is also possible for austenite to spontaneously convert to martensite at low temperatures. To complicate matters further, the magnetic properties of these alloys depend on the alloy composition. Within the allowed ranges of variation of Ni and Cr, significant differences in magnetic properties may be observed for a given alloy.
(...)
What can be done to minimize the magnetization of stainless steel components? With its higher nickel composition range, 316 is considered the “most nonmagnetic” stainless steel. However, an item of 316 stainless steel which has significant welding or machining may be sufficiently magnetic to produce a noticeable attraction when brought near a magnet. “Ferrite free” welding rods are available to minimize the tendency of welds to become magnetic. In principle, a welded or machined component can be annealed to restore it to its nonmagnetic state, although this is not always convenient. Selecting a 316 stainless steel with nickel content that is in the upper side of the allowed content range may also be helpful, but again, may not always be practical. The 316N stainless steel alloy is expected to have less of a tendency to become magnetic than 316 or 316L, however, it may not be readily available.
(...)
Probing a 316 stainless steel weldment or machined structure with a magnet or a susceptibility meter can produce surprising results given that this alloy is considered nonmagnetic. A small deposit of ferrite in the weld on an outer vacuum vessel of a high field magnet is unlikely to be of concern. However, even a minute amount of ferromagnetic material is likely to be unacceptable in the sample holder of a nuclear magnetic resonance probe. This is a case where aluminum or copper should be employed for metal parts.
..."
source: http://www.mtm-inc.com/reduce_project_r ... ss_steels/
=====
Tanks for the patience.
Alexa
welderkid556
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hello, i have another question. this dualshield wire ive been running inside my Airco dip-pak 200 mig welder, sometimes i get porosity in the welds and other times it is smooth. i know this wire is meant to run the same polarity as plain mig welding except you turn up the heat and the wire speed to make a nice clean smooth weld. but this mig welder, i wasnt sure if these machines came off the factory floor dcep or dcen for polarity. help plz lol. i wasnt sure if wrong polarity would cause porosity with this wire or not. im also not sure if these machines could change polarity if i needed it to.
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When you open the cover to the feeder, you should see two posts with cables leading to the wire feed and ground cable. If so, a polarity swap is simple; switch the cables.
If not, you'll have to take more covers off to swap them, but it is possible.
Dual-shield wires are tricky... Some require DCEP, some DCEN, and you need to check the data sheet for the particular wire.
That's one detail most schools skip, because they only use one wire, so the subject never comes up.
Steve S
If not, you'll have to take more covers off to swap them, but it is possible.
Dual-shield wires are tricky... Some require DCEP, some DCEN, and you need to check the data sheet for the particular wire.
That's one detail most schools skip, because they only use one wire, so the subject never comes up.
Steve S
welderkid556
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The Dualshield wire i have been useing is the same we used in the school. Esab Dualshield 7100 ultra. the guys at our local welding supply store and steel provider, they also do welding repair and other things of that nature. but they said run this wire just like ya do hard wire. in the school we used an esab migmaster 250 which ran very hot. my Airco dip-pak 200 runs very hot also, i read up and basicly the esab and the airco are the same machine except my airco is more primitive and basic. the esab migmaster, we used dualshield in it for schooling and it ran same polarity as hard wire. i know which wire you are talking about inside the machine, there is a big cable coming to the wire feeder, and the ground cable is connected to a ground outlet on the bottom left corner of the front face of the machine. the side i pull down to install wire is on the right side of the machine. i would have to pull the left panel off to check it out plus i probably need to blow the dust bunnies out also. but given i do have the correct polarity what would make this dualshield 7100 get porosity and snail trails under the slag? ive already upgraded my gas nozzle size to 5/8. do i need 3/4 inch nozzle to be sufficent enough for the gas coverage i need?
- Otto Nobedder
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You said the wire "twists" as it comes off the roll into the feeder. See if the drive rollers meet correctly. A misalaignment between the drive rollers, either an offset at the meeting point, or an angular misalaignment, will twist the wire. Think of the automatic thrower at football practice putting a sprial on the throw because the drive wheels are intentionally misaligned. A misalignment could be causing the exposed core, assuming you only see it at the gun, not on the roll.Steve S
welderkid556
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different wire than i was talking about. the spiraling twisting line was in the hobart 140. this is the airco 200 machine i run with dualshield. the boart had the cheap wire. this airco im running has the dual shield, the wire i was having trouble with was that cheap chinese crap in the hobart. this airco is running dualshield and hasnt been doing anything wrong inside the machine, its only at the business end is where it will mess up maybe 25 % of the time and give me porosity.
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Actually, I was talking about the Hobart. Hadn't really moved to the Airco challenge yet.
Does the cheap wire on the Hobart look fine on the spool, and come out the gun boogered up? Look at the drive rollers. The twisting is the clue. A bent shaft on the idler side, a missing spacer, anything that could mismatch the rollers could cause the twisting, and damage the wire.
Steve S
Does the cheap wire on the Hobart look fine on the spool, and come out the gun boogered up? Look at the drive rollers. The twisting is the clue. A bent shaft on the idler side, a missing spacer, anything that could mismatch the rollers could cause the twisting, and damage the wire.
Steve S
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As for the occasional problems with the Airco, I'd suspect the gas first. Moisture is a good candidate. Ususally, a purity issue will give you trouble through the whole bottle. Moisture is more likely to show up sporadically. Jody has a video on a gas dryer (Yes, it happens often enough to make a video about it), but you can buy a simple dessicant-dryer cartridge at Harbor-Freight, and install it in-line after the flowmeter. They're made for compressed air to 150 PSI, and flowmeters are regulated to 75 PSI or less. The benefit is they are see-through, and change color when they collect moisture. It's a $5 or less way to test.
Steve S
Steve S
welderkid556
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ive been running this hobart for about 6 years but not to a industrial standard. just on and off and ive ran many small spools through it, i maintain the machine and it runs like a top. the roller motor is in perfect condition. i took the cheap wire apart and its all messed up. it was twisting coming off of the spool. i pulled it apart foot by foot and its toast. i threw the lincoln innershield in and its running perfectly fine now with no complaints and its not twisting or coming through the tip boogered up.
as for my airco, the gas bottle ive been running, i run the dualshield through it and i run solid wire also. with the solid wire i have no problems, runs 110% every time, in short circuit or spray transfer its awesome. i switch to the dualshield and 25% of the time i get porosity.
as for my airco, the gas bottle ive been running, i run the dualshield through it and i run solid wire also. with the solid wire i have no problems, runs 110% every time, in short circuit or spray transfer its awesome. i switch to the dualshield and 25% of the time i get porosity.
welderkid556
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got the steel in today for the new tower.... yay... lol. i have a question about steel plate. our plate we are useing for the tower base is 4 ft by 4 ft 3/4 inch steel. our machine shop that we pay to do the things i cant do, they are useing a torch to cut the hole out in the center for my 4 inch peice of pipe to go inside of. i was worried about the heat from the torch warping it but the first plate they did didnt seem to warp to the naked eye. but he said his plasma cutter wouldnt cut 3/4 inch steel. what gives? ive heard of alot of plasma cutters being able to cut through inch and 1/4 plate or so i heard. wasnt sure if he didnt want to try it with the plasma cutter or if he doesnt know it will work.
williejack
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Hey,use the lincoln wire I use that for all my fcaw except ss.For s.s I use avasta,make sure you have a min,of 40 on the flow meter with fcaw ,the 140 hobart is enough welder for the job ,Good luck.
williejack
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Most Plasma"s only go to 3/8 after that it"s water jet or laser or the plain old torch depends on what"s practical.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJ8nqYRgwx0
http://www.everlastgenerators.com/Power ... 17-pd.html
http://www.everlastgenerators.com/Power ... 17-pd.html
williejack wrote:Most Plasma"s only go to 3/8 after that it"s water jet or laser or the plain old torch depends on what"s practical.
williejack
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Werk Space,maybe i should have stated it a little better if you want to take more time to plaz the piece than it would take with a cutting torch okay .Normally when i reach for a plaz it is for speed and little clean up.Good vid for the machine ,cheaper to run a air compressor than to buy oxy/ace,or everybody"s favorite lately propolyne.
I thought that this video was interesting.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vHcda3FSaKs
They drill a large diameter hole thru 2" thick steel in 60 seconds.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vHcda3FSaKs
They drill a large diameter hole thru 2" thick steel in 60 seconds.
- Otto Nobedder
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For a plasma cutter to make accurate cuts without distortion/warpage on steel thicker than, say, 5/8", it's usually done on a CNC plasma table, with the cut done under water. This is expensive equipment.
I can't count the 2" steel base-plates I've cut with a track-torch, and even cut 1-1/4" bolt-holes in them freehand with the right tip in good quality oxy/acet. equipment (though a mag-drill was preferred).
A 3/4" base plate of that size in the hands of a skilled cutter will not distort enough to detect with anything less than a dial-guage that reads to .0005", and the original plate is off that much or more when you start.
Steve S
I can't count the 2" steel base-plates I've cut with a track-torch, and even cut 1-1/4" bolt-holes in them freehand with the right tip in good quality oxy/acet. equipment (though a mag-drill was preferred).
A 3/4" base plate of that size in the hands of a skilled cutter will not distort enough to detect with anything less than a dial-guage that reads to .0005", and the original plate is off that much or more when you start.
Steve S
welderkid556
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i have a cutting torch setup with long hoses for long enough reach i can walk around my house from my shop in the back and cut whatever i need to cut. i am running propane and oxygen. i went to the propane because its pretty decent for cutting up scrap and stuff up to 3/8 thick for cutting, and it takes longer to heat up the steel than with accetline. i started out with accetline but couldnt afford it at the time because i didnt have much money. but now im working more frequently i think ill buy an average size accetline tank in case i have some heavy heating to do. accetline never did last very long for me but this propane seems like it lasts forever, ive gone through 5 oxygen tanks with this 1 propane bottle and its just like a normal small propane bottle, nothing special but the accetline heats up better for bending rods and such for tempering steel. i had a plasma cutter but sent it back, i ordered a everlast powertig 200dx from amazon and they sent me a 50 amp plasma cutter???!!! i was sort of confused but i looked over the plasma cutter, it looked pretty decent but i didnt do anything with it but put it back in the box and wait for ups to pick it up and take it back then when i got my money back i ordered my everlast powertig 200dx tig machine from ebay, the seller was actually everlast in california and they gave me a decent deal so i ordered it and when it arrived it wasnt long and i was welding with it. which comes me to another problem with gases. this tig welder eats up a 155 size tank of argon and i know i have no leaks, i may have the pre-flow and post-flow up too high but id rather not be grinding tungsten rods the rest of my days either.
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I've never used "pre-flow", and I do ASME code welds. By the time the HF Start engages, I've got a ton of gas. I rarely have my postflow above 10 seconds for anything.
I also prefer a gas lens, so my gas is rarely above 15 cfh indoors, although I'll turn it up to 25 for aluminum.
A tip on ALL high-pressure bottles... open them tight, just like you close them tight. Don't just open them a turn or two, take them to the open stop, and tighten it. The bottle valve has a positive seal at full-open. Part-open relies on the valve packing to seal in the gas. Did you soap-bubble test the valve stem on the bottle?
Steve S
I also prefer a gas lens, so my gas is rarely above 15 cfh indoors, although I'll turn it up to 25 for aluminum.
A tip on ALL high-pressure bottles... open them tight, just like you close them tight. Don't just open them a turn or two, take them to the open stop, and tighten it. The bottle valve has a positive seal at full-open. Part-open relies on the valve packing to seal in the gas. Did you soap-bubble test the valve stem on the bottle?
Steve S
welderkid556
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i do the soap bubble testing on all of my machines if i have gas hooked up and they usually do fine. and i dont have to tighten them too much usually either. in the welding school i went to my instructor said open the valves only half way in case you need to turn them off quickly in case of fire like with propane or accetline. but usually i open the bottles fully but i dont usually open them really tight in case i need to turn off quickly. the gas cup i use is just the average number 7 tig cup, works fine so far and i have alot of other sizes but number 7 is the biggest i have and im not getting any porosity with this tig machine i love it. the gas flow rate i have set is around 15 cfm i believe.
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As for the bottles,
If you take the OSHA 10 or 30 for industrial, the recommendation is to open low-pressure bottles (fuel--acetylene (dissolved), propylene (I don't know if that's disolved or stored liquid), propane (stored liquid)) 1/4 - 1/2 turn only, for rapid shutoff in case of fire; You can kill the fuel source with one turn of the wrist. High-pressure bottles, and specifically oxygen in this example, are to be opened to the stop to prevent a leakage accumulation of oxidizer in the immediate vicinity of your fuel bottle.
The low pressure bottles are designed and certified for the valve packing to hold against the pressure, but, like you, I always either soap test them, or do a retention (Meaning open the valve, wait five seconds, close the valve, and see if the guage moves within five minutes).
I've seen several torch hose pairs burn like the Fourth of July from careless people burning through them with cutting slag. Shutting the fuel off extinguishes them almost immediately, even with the oxygen pouring out at 80 PSI.
Quick tip for everybody... If you ever see someone blow out a torch hose like this, get between the fire and the bottle, and kink the lines like a garden hose until someone can shut the gas off.
Steve S
If you take the OSHA 10 or 30 for industrial, the recommendation is to open low-pressure bottles (fuel--acetylene (dissolved), propylene (I don't know if that's disolved or stored liquid), propane (stored liquid)) 1/4 - 1/2 turn only, for rapid shutoff in case of fire; You can kill the fuel source with one turn of the wrist. High-pressure bottles, and specifically oxygen in this example, are to be opened to the stop to prevent a leakage accumulation of oxidizer in the immediate vicinity of your fuel bottle.
The low pressure bottles are designed and certified for the valve packing to hold against the pressure, but, like you, I always either soap test them, or do a retention (Meaning open the valve, wait five seconds, close the valve, and see if the guage moves within five minutes).
I've seen several torch hose pairs burn like the Fourth of July from careless people burning through them with cutting slag. Shutting the fuel off extinguishes them almost immediately, even with the oxygen pouring out at 80 PSI.
Quick tip for everybody... If you ever see someone blow out a torch hose like this, get between the fire and the bottle, and kink the lines like a garden hose until someone can shut the gas off.
Steve S
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While I'm on my soapbox,
I'd like to remind everyone not to transport or store acetylene bottles on their sides, unless you can afford to let them stand unused for a few hours after.
Acetylene is not bottled as a gas under pressure like oxygen or argon. It becomes unstable and highly reactive above 15 PSI, which is why your regulator has that red line from 15 psi up.
Acetylene is dissolved in acetone, in a fiber substrate in that bottle. Storing it on it's side allows acetone to accumulate at the valve, and it must be allowed to settle out. Blowing acetone, a strong solvent, through your regulator and lines is not healthy for your torch.
Steve S
I'd like to remind everyone not to transport or store acetylene bottles on their sides, unless you can afford to let them stand unused for a few hours after.
Acetylene is not bottled as a gas under pressure like oxygen or argon. It becomes unstable and highly reactive above 15 PSI, which is why your regulator has that red line from 15 psi up.
Acetylene is dissolved in acetone, in a fiber substrate in that bottle. Storing it on it's side allows acetone to accumulate at the valve, and it must be allowed to settle out. Blowing acetone, a strong solvent, through your regulator and lines is not healthy for your torch.
Steve S
My brother woke up in Vancouver yesterday, when his apartment building shook.
The story pretty much explains it all. A plumber storing acetylene in his vehicle.
I wonder what his insurance company has to say about this policy?
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/bri ... e12057894/
I use acetylene quite frequently and I am aware of the risks.
The following video shows how the rednecks use it to make trailers disappear in seconds.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1gsCuQthy60
The story pretty much explains it all. A plumber storing acetylene in his vehicle.
I wonder what his insurance company has to say about this policy?
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/bri ... e12057894/
I use acetylene quite frequently and I am aware of the risks.
The following video shows how the rednecks use it to make trailers disappear in seconds.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1gsCuQthy60
Otto Nobedder wrote:While I'm on my soapbox,
I'd like to remind everyone not to transport or store acetylene bottles on their sides, unless you can afford to let them stand unused for a few hours after.
Acetylene is not bottled as a gas under pressure like oxygen or argon. It becomes unstable and highly reactive above 15 PSI, which is why your regulator has that red line from 15 psi up. Acetylene is dissolved in acetone, in a fiber substrate in that bottle. Storing it on it's side allows acetone to accumulate at the valve, and it must be allowed to settle out. Blowing acetone, a strong solvent, through your regulator and lines is not healthy for your torch.
Steve S
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welderkid556
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well thats an interesting story and a nice photo. ive heard about people transporting oxygen tanks in the trunks of cars and somehow the valve gets knocked off and blasts through the car, ripping the body in half. i live maybe half a mile from my welding supply store that refills gases and refilled tanks, i take my old tank over in the back of my truck in a secure spot, and exchange it with a new bottle then go right back home and pack it inside because i cant roll it through the mud and ive never had any problems but we also use caps over the valves, always. our welding supply store will not accept a tank with a cap missing.