Welding Tips and Tricks

Have some frame alterations coming up so I've been practising on chunks of aluminium beam sliced out of the main spar of a wrecked superbike. The stuff is just over 2mm thick.

Have tried many settings, but what you see here is 75 amps AC square wave, 60Hz, 2.4mm 2% Lanth electrode, 2.4mm 5356 filler, #6 gas lens cup, about 10lpm gas. 7 sec post flow.

Ignore the pepper and crap in a couple of the beads, I simply didn't clean those properly.

I am starting to get reasonably even beads but they seem a tad too tall and narrow. There seems to be plenty of heat and I'm moving quite fast...am I simply feeding in too much filler?

Would appreciate any suggestions at all.


Kym

Hey Kym. The third bead from the top...you started out great and then you can see where the really defined edges of your stack of dimes begins to obscure and smooth out.That is the base metal heating up and then the toe of the weld starts to get uneven.It looks like you are traveling a little fast which is a pedal/amperage concern. It looks to me like you aren't feathering the pedal (you didn't say if you are using a pedal)and backing down the amperage as the part heats up. If you back the torch up a little as you dip your filler you will get a taller bead so it might not be too much filler. There are so many variables to aluminum so it's hard to nail down what exactly is happening but I do see small heat issues and that causes travel speed issues. When you are chasing the puddle, trying to control it, you tend to get an uneven weld bead. I think you just need a little more pedal practice. If you aren't using a pedal on aluminum then you are taking the hard road uphill You are almost there and it just looks like a little more practice is all thats needed. I don't do alot of aluminum so I am definitely not an expert but there are telltale signs in every weld bead and that is my diagnosis.

ps...I think 7 second post flow is too much but only you are the judge of that.

Remember Jody's video on 3mm aluminium? He really let the bead sink in before adding filler. I have never done it, but it comes to mind.

Mick

Thanks for the tips guys!

Exnail...yes, I'm using a pedal but I think you have a good point, although I am indeed backing off when the heat starts soaking in, I probably need more practise feathering the pedal. On the bead you refer to, the spot where it all starts going pear-shaped also coincides with a small 'peak' in the curve of the metal where I have to adjust my torch angle, so I have a couple things going on there to stay on top of.

Really appreciate your input. Just focusing on that bead you see third from the top...(the only half decent one ) do you feel it is a little tall and narrow, or reasonably okay?

EDIT - anyone got a link to that 3mm aluminium video of Jody's that Mike mentions? Mike? Have had a look but can't seem to track it down.


Kym

MosquitoMoto wrote:Thanks for the tips guys!

Exnail...yes, I'm using a pedal but I think you have a good point, although I am indeed backing off when the heat starts soaking in, I probably need more practise feathering the pedal. On the bead you refer to, the spot where it all starts going pear-shaped also coincides with a small 'peak' in the curve of the metal where I have to adjust my torch angle, so I have a couple things going on there to stay on top of.

Really appreciate your input. Just focusing on that bead you see third from the top...(the only half decent one ) do you feel it is a little tall and narrow, or reasonably okay?


Kym

Well Kym, like I said I don't get to play with aluminum too much but I do practice with it to keep my skills so I am probably no the best person to ask. The 3rd weld looks a little cold but that could be the camera angle. With the new inverter machines, you can do a smaller bead so I am not going to give an opinion on whether its too narrow. I like narrow beads but others may not. If you look at that weld, you can see different travel speeds but I was not aware of arch in the metal. I really just think you need some seat time and you will be good to go. Weld porn quality is pretty but in the real world not always attainable so I would say your weld is reasonably ok. Jody makes it look so easy that it frustrating sometimes but if you listen as much as watch him, he tells you how to make it easy. Too many of us want to watch a vid and then run to the shop and try the weld we just saw and when it doesn't come out just right we wonder why. Listen to Jody talk and you will see why he is Yoda. Also...my son took a few pics of me welding and as he was watching me, he asked what I was doing with the pedal. He said that I am pushing it down, backing off and making small adjustments and it shocked me because I don't even realise I am doing it. It's like driving a motorcycle...we are sometimes doing 4 or 5 or more things at at time and we are not aware of it. The puddle will tell you everything you need to know and your pedal foot should be keeping the rythm.

Good advice for sure, more seat time.

I probably need to get back to watching some of Jody's videos again, too. Six months ago I swear I'd almost memorised his whole archive, but watching them a second and even third time I often pick up little nuggets of info I'd missed.

Every time I weld aluminium I then hold my beads up alongside the frame welds on one of my motorcycles...that's the standard I am trying to match. I have a long way to go and I may never get there but I'll keep trying. I know some of those welds are possibly robotic and others are simply welded by amazing, lifetime welders, but I like to aim high.

Thanks again and by all means keep the advice coming!




Kym

MosquitoMoto wrote:Good advice for sure, more seat time.

I probably need to get back to watching some of Jody's videos again, too. Six months ago I swear I'd almost memorised his whole archive, but watching them a second and even third time I often pick up little nuggets of info I'd missed.

Every time I weld aluminium I then hold my beads up alongside the frame welds on one of my motorcycles...that's the standard I am trying to match. I have a long way to go and I may never get there but I'll keep trying. I know some of those welds are possibly robotic and others are simply welded by amazing, lifetime welders, but I like to aim high.

Thanks again and by all means keep the advice coming!




Kym

The welds you are comparing to are done by people that weld aluminum every day, all day so they can do it in their sleep. They have shiny brand new metal, have everything set up in a jig in a comfortable position in a nice clean shop somewhere with the best of everything so you are being unfair to yourself comparing what you do to full time welders. No one is born with the ability to Tig weld so they had to learn and practice too. You will do fine because you have the pride to want to be good. One day it will click and you will wonder why you made it so hard on yourself

kym
practice getting the puddle going with a lot of peddle the back off
enough to keep the puddle wet. try keeping the peddle in that
same spot ( or very close) till you can feed the rod at he same speed and keep
an even bead. this drill might help. also don't set the amps to to high, this
will give you more control with the peddle.
craig

motox wrote:kym
practice getting the puddle going with a lot of peddle the back off
enough to keep the puddle wet. try keeping the peddle in that
same spot ( or very close) till you can feed the rod at he same speed and keep
an even bead. this drill might help. also don't set the amps to to high, this
will give you more control with the peddle.
craig

More good advice, thanks Craig.

A few have mentioned 'pedal', I think that might be the key, I need to work on my pedal control, come to recognise that spot when wire feed is steady and even (I've started counting to myself "And one...and two...") and practise, practise, practise.

I'll keep trying. It is always fun because I am constantly learning.

EDIT: And I probably need to stop playing the newbie card, just realised I've been welding nearly 10 months.


Kym

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TidFih7Dpus

heres one, im not sure if its the exact one i mentioned.

mick

Thanks Mike - that one is pretty helpful.

About to head out and have another shot at this...I'll try to throw some photos on here if I can so we can all compare.

Cheers,


Kym

No problem mate.

Finally got this sussed - no photos at the moment, will try to grab some later.

Two factors:

* A bit more heat - from 75 amps to 80

* Different filler technique

I re-watched a heap of videos and eventually something got into my thick head...the fact that Jody generally dabs the filler lightly...I'd been 'shoving' rather than dabbing. I think I'd subconsciously become paranoid about melt through and I was compensating by really driving that filler in there. Of course this cooled the bead and resulted in it being taller than necessary.

Now I'm dabbing and the bead finally looks like it should.

It really was just a matter of my having developed a bad habit.

Thanks for your input and advice guys!




Kym

kym
that is what makes his videos so valuable.
someone can tell you over and over how to
do something and if a picture worth a thousand
words a good video is priceless.
craig

motox wrote:kym
that is what makes his videos so valuable.
someone can tell you over and over how to
do something and if a picture worth a thousand
words a good video is priceless.
craig

Jody makes welding seem effortless because for him, it's like riding a bike....all muscle memory. I have said many times to listen as much as watch his videos because he doesn't leave out anything. Mr Tig forgets to show us his welds sometimes

ive just been reading a heap of tig threads to read tips i can pick up on when my tig welder will arrive (in 2 weeks). can someone explain what you mean by "feathering the pedal" ? is it just a general term for backing off the amperage? once i know that, this thread will make alot more sense .


thanks

noah

Least honorable wrote:ive just been reading a heap of tig threads to read tips i can pick up on when my tig welder will arrive (in 2 weeks). can someone explain what you mean by "feathering the pedal" ? is it just a general term for backing off the amperage? once i know that, this thread will make alot more sense .


thanks

noah

It's another term for 'modulating' the pedal. In short, lighting up, often with full pedal, then once you have a puddle going, backing off a little to avoid overheating as you move on, then continually reading the puddle and making minute adjustments depending on how how things are behaving down at the arc.

Practise, practise, practise.

I am slowly getting better. I used to not back off enough and thus overheat my aluminium welding all the time. I am slowly getting to the point where I am able to fine tune things and hold a fairly steady peal after a little while. Still a long way from creating 'pretty' welds though.


Kym

MosquitoMoto wrote:

Least honorable wrote:ive just been reading a heap of tig threads to read tips i can pick up on when my tig welder will arrive (in 2 weeks). can someone explain what you mean by "feathering the pedal" ? is it just a general term for backing off the amperage? once i know that, this thread will make alot more sense .


thanks

noah

It's another term for 'modulating' the pedal. In short, lighting up, often with full pedal, then once you have a puddle going, backing off a little to avoid overheating as you move on, then continually reading the puddle and making minute adjustments depending on how how things are behaving down at the arc.

Practise, practise, practise.

I am slowly getting better. I used to not back off enough and thus overheat my aluminium welding all the time. I am slowly getting to the point where I am able to fine tune things and hold a fairly steady peal after a little while. Still a long way from creating 'pretty' welds though.


Kym

so if im not mistaken, youre saying that for aluminum its better to start with more amps then needed to get the puddle going, than back off a little bit (but not too much, so that the bead doesnt have too high a profile) instead of starting at for example 75 amps, waiting for it to puddle and when you see it get too hot, back off? not sure if i worded it properly, but i think you get the idea, sorry if its a dumb question, but i want to be 100% sure
thanks
noah

Noah -

This took me awhile to learn. When I started on aluminium I was paranoid about melt through, so I'd start out cooler and take ages to get a puddle going. That actually created much more heat soak that light up with plenty of amps, getting a puddle going fast, then backing off a little and moving out.

Definitely better to get a puddle going in 2 or 3 seconds and then continue welding at, say, 3/4 pedal than to start out at low amps and hang around forever heating everything up.

No such thing as a dumb question!


Kym

MosquitoMoto wrote:

Have some frame alterations coming up so I've been practising on chunks of aluminium

Brother:
That is the worst idea imaginable. If you really have a death wish then this is likely a very good way to have that wish granted. Those frames are basically unibodies, just like a car, and that aluminum is very prone to cracking. My old boss mostly welded aluminum and I saw several wrecked superbikes come into the shop. He always sent those customers away sorry because he wasn't willing to weld on something when he knew that it was likely to kill them later. Those are the ONLY things that I ever saw him refuse to weld on.

Raymond -

Fear not. The only work being done (common on older track bikes) is surgery to take out a small 'window' of aluminium on the inside shoulder of the frame, remove the sound deadening rubber blocks and weld the window back in again.

The window is on the flat, and probably half the size of a cigarette pack.

Apart from that there is the potential for welding in some stiffening braces at the headstock, and eventually I'll be making up some detachable subframes from scratch.

But I'd certainly never get into radical slicing up and alteration of frames. Yes because it's dangerous, but also because the factories spend bazillions on tuning and testing the geometry of these things to make them handle properly, so I doubt that some guy in a shed would be able to make any improvements on that.

But thanks for your concern!



Kym

This article is about bicycle frames but it applies to ALL aluminum frames. A quick read will reveal the danger that you are about to expose yourself to.

http://m.pinkbike.com/news/To-the-Point ... rames.html

Those bikes have the engine as a stressed member which means that vibration is dampened throughout the entire frame rather than through rubber mounts. The result is that those vibrations will uncover weaknesses in the heat affected zone of the weld and exploit them. Couple that with the high torque the engine puts on that thin aluminum and BLAMO!!!! She just came unbuttoned at a high rate of speed.

Thanks for sharing Raymond.

And some of those bicycle frames are beautiful.

Still unconvinced as to the frame failure issue though. Simply because I know so many guys (and I know them well) who race at my local track who have carried out this procedure and have gone on to race for years (the bikes tend to be pre-2003 superbikes, so rather than being updated they are just campaigned year after year) without cracking or any kind of failure. It's a rough track and some of these are open class bikes.

But again, I honestly appreciate your concern.

Cheers,


Kym