[MTBob]

Here's my situation - long time amatuer welder, first time posting on this forum (avid fan of Jody's videos).
Just bought a Thermal Arc 186 to venture into TIG. OMG, the "torch" is bigger than a chipping hammer, what a beast. I kinda knew that before I bought it, but it's even bigger than I thought. After using it for a while, it's much too heavy for my arthritic hands to manage for any lenght of time. So, I want to downsize the torch, to a #9 (perhaps a CK20).
I think I'd like to get a water cooled torch to get maximum capacity for the size.
So, I have some questions:
- Most of my TIG work will be limited to small projects and not for business. Is water cooling worth it? (BTW I also have a Miller 251 MIG)
- How much weight difference is there in the lead between a gas or water cooled torch?
- How much stiffer does the lead get with a water cooled torch?
- And, what torch do you'all recommend for my situation?
Any ideas / opinions are welcome - Thanks in advance.
Bob
.

[Otto Nobedder]

Welcome, Bob,

Boy, are you in for a surprise. That CK20 water-cooled weighs less, the leads are more flexible.

I've burned a -20 torch at 300 amps (50 over it's rating) for 20 minutes at a time.

Go for it, and you'll never look back.

Steve S

[rick9345]

Welcome, Bob,

Boy, are you in for a surprise. That CK20 water-cooled weighs less, the leads are more flexible.

I've burned a -20 torch at 300 amps (50 over it's rating) for 20 minutes at a time.

Go for it, and you'll never look back.

Steve S

Same with my CK FL230 with a series 3 head(comes with a series 2 head, same size as a 9)series 2 and 3 interchangeable on the FL Your TA 186 will be happy with water cool. Your hand will be comfortable.
I also use a CK #9 gas cooled and have been known to push it at 160-180 amps, but it gets warm with more than a few inches of weld. Get the superflex hose
I use the flex head style, for home use get some kind of flex head torch, tight spots aren't so tight and old stiff hands,like mine need that adjust ability.

[MosquitoMoto]

I recently went from a huge size 26 gas cooled torch to size 9 gas cooled.

It's been a revelation, but it heats up fast, especially when welding aluminium. If you can afford to go size 20 liquid cooled you will never go back. Enjoy!


Kym

[Oscar]

Aside from cost and assuming proper precautions are taken, there is no dis-advantage to using a water-cooled setup CK20-type of setup.

[Bill Beauregard]

A water cooled torch controls the heat buildup in not only the torch you hold in your hand, but the torch lead. Mine (280 amps) uses a 2/0 ground lead, but #10 conductor to torch. It weighs lots less, and is smaller than the air cooled torch on the Diversion 180 I had.

If you don't want a cooler, they work with sink water. or buy a used cooler.

[MTBob]

Thanks to everyone for your comments, very helpful! I'm always impressed with forums like this one where there are professional folks who take their valuable time to help others - particularly on Thanksgiving Day.
I believe you have persuaded me to go with water cooling. As it turns out I happen to have an abandoned washing machine location right next to my welders and we have really pure Rocky Mountain well water. So, I think I can simply connect the torch to the water spigot, put a restriction valve on the discharge to reduce flow and dump it into the drain line. Perhaps I should put a pressure reducer on the inlet line. Does that make sense? If I have a water source like this why would I need a separate water cooler, other than for mobility?
Again, thanks for all your support.
Bob

[Poland308]

There is a down side to using tap water. That is the minerals in the water will drop out of the water at an excelerated rate at temps above 180 deg f. So you might get mineral deposits building up in the small passages in you new torch that will shorten it's life. That's why distilled water combined with recomended additives is best. Many of the additive products also contain inhibitors to protect against corrosion and minimize mineral build up.

[motox]

if you are going water cooled get a adjustable head
and be done with it.
i know what its like with arthritic hands and
you can adjust the angle to ease your grip
on the torch with one.
craig

[Braehill]

Bob,
I've used everything in a water cooled torch that you're Not supposed to for over 30 years and have never had problems. I have a set up in my "go bag" that has a strainer and a garden hose adapter that I can hook up if needed. There has been miles of pipe welded in this plant with an identical set up without problems.

Hook up to your sink and don't give it another thought. I've done conductivity tests on everything from automotive antifreeze to softened water to RV antifreeze. I have all the equipment here at the plant to test this and water from the softener that spent 14 months in a water cooler only picked up 40 units on the meter, nothing really. I use RV antifreeze in my cooler only because my garage isn't heated and I froze and split my power cord a couple years ago.

Well water will have minerals that build up in the head. If you get a jug of CLR and push through the head of the torch a couple times a year and let it set over night, then flush it out with your next setting you'll be fine.

CK Worldwide torches have larger passages through the head supposedly and they have a # 20/25ft. one on sale at Weldfabulous.com right now for about $135.

Len

[Bill Beauregard]

I once repaired a lot of electric water heaters. Minerals will build up on the heating elements inside the tanks. As the coating gets thick enough, It absorbs water. When the heater next turns on this water becomes steam. Tiny explosions blast this stuff off forming soft little pieces of plaster cast like chunks. They settle to the bottom of the tank, where they cover the bottom element. When the sediment layer is deep enough water can't get to it to keep it cool. steam surrounds it, and it overheats and burns out. Repair includes an hour with a little homemade "shovel" scooping out all the mineral through an 1-1/4" hole. Usually, as much as 5 gallons of crumbly chunks.

I tell you this because public water systems seem to have a little mineral, private well water, a LOT! Bottom elements on our local water system (200 houses) last 25 years. On well water 3 months.

Softened water uses a process called ion exchange. It substitutes salt for other minerals. Salt brings a worse set of issues, as does chlorine.

[MTBob]

While we seem to have relatively soft well water, we do get a minor amount of scale build up on our shower heads. Haven't seen the need to install a whole house water softener. But, I can see the need to treat the water ciruculating through a hot torch head.
So, for my situation, rather than buying and maintaining another piece of equipment how about simply installing an inline water filter something like this?:
http://www.autogeek.net/clinhofianda.html
Bob

[Poland308]

Get the best grade cartridge you can the paper or string ones don't stop much more than sand. Look for one that's for an ice machine there designed for catching minerals and generally come with push lock fittings for 1/4 in tube that will fit both copper or plastic tube.

[jauguston]

I have been using city water to cool my 20 torch for the last 10 + years with no problems. The only down side is my shop is not heated unless I am going to be in it so I have to drain the water from the torch line so it doesn't freeze in the winter. I am currently building a aluminum 4 gallon tank to use as a cooler with RV antifreeze for coolant for the Miller Diversion 180 I just bought and converted to a 20 torch with a 25' super flex whip so I don't have to drain it. Before I was using a Century 230A buzz box and scratch starting tig. But I finally "had" to be able to weld aluminum (-: I started with a air cooled torch but it didn't take long to see it sucked. Being a gadget guy I now have also added a Smith Proportional mixer to add Helium for thicker aluminum and a Tig Perfect for pulsing to the Diversion.

Jim


'

[Stevoo]

Get a water cooled torch. It makes a huge difference. You will be a happy camper.
As far as what water system you use, that is a whole othet subject.
Lots of ways to skin that dog.

['Stang]

Here's my situation - long time amatuer welder, first time posting on this forum (avid fan of Jody's videos).
Just bought a Thermal Arc 186 to venture into TIG. OMG, the "torch" is bigger than a chipping hammer, what a beast. I kinda knew that before I bought it, but it's even bigger than I thought. After using it for a while, it's much too heavy for my arthritic hands to manage for any lenght of time. So, I want to downsize the torch, to a #9 (perhaps a CK20).
I think I'd like to get a water cooled torch to get maximum capacity for the size.
So, I have some questions:
- Most of my TIG work will be limited to small projects and not for business. Is water cooling worth it? (BTW I also have a Miller 251 MIG)
- How much weight difference is there in the lead between a gas or water cooled torch?
- How much stiffer does the lead get with a water cooled torch?
- And, what torch do you'all recommend for my situation?
Any ideas / opinions are welcome - Thanks in advance.

No! I too have aging hands. It is not worth it to go to water cooled. 1-you are just doing small projects. That means you are not on a schedule! With your machine-you are not running high amps. Get a 17 style torch, with a super-flex cable.
They are light and the cable is flexible enough that it will not put a strain on your wrist. I love the CK flex-lock! You can adjust the head to any angle and lock it in. Just my opion-for what it's worth!! Hope this helps.

Bob
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