Welding Tips and Tricks

Could someone please measure a WP9 collet where it goes into the back cap.
I got some delivered today and they are little large so they dont slip into the back cap properly.
I didnt test them but I doubt the cap will seal.
I was under the assumption a WP9 collet would have the same dimensions world-wide but I can be wrong.

thanks for any help

Hello, Anders,
Parts for type 9 and type 20 torches will usually have part numbers that start with 13N. Type 17, 18, and 26 torch parts have part numbers that start with 10N. Are your collets imprinted or engraved with part numbers? I wonder if your packaging was mislabeled.

My home life gets busy in the evening but I'll try to remember to measure a type 9 collet!

No marking other than electrode size.

Length is same as size 9, just the diameter approx 0,5 mm larger.

For the wider portion of the collet as indicated in your picture, my 10N collet is 0.248 inches / 6.35mm. A 13N collet is 0.202 in / 5.14 mm

Hopefully my measuring device is accurate enough.

Thanks
my old are 4.5 mm while the new is 5.05mm
Back cap is 4.75 mm so there is a mismatch....

My collets for my 26 torch are 6.4 mm so those seem to be as yours. I think they said they are Binzel collets.

My old ones are most likely Parweld consumables, either there is a "Euro"-style or they just changed theirs to make people buy from same source.

I'll drill the back caps if needed and I dont find larger ones from a different source.

I bought some parts on ebay from China and the collets will not fit the original Weldcraft backcap, only the Chinese... Guess I can turn them down a bit

GlenC wrote:...I can turn them down a bit

Could you chuck them into a drill, and remove some of the OD with sandpaper? This idea might work for you, Anders, if you don't have a lathe. Would there be a concern with losing structural or electrical integrity?

That would work but I preffer drill out 3 caps rather than sanding 30 collets

You should check the overall length of the collets, I've found some " no name brand " collets are about 1mm too short , after they get hot and bow, they lose their crush.

Avoid the Chinese crap consumables and buy name brand, e.g. C & K, Weldcraft, Tec Torch and others.

Something else to consider.

noddybrian wrote:It's not always obvious with collets - all I can say is when they're new & straight & copper colored you never have a problem - but once they've been overheated a few times they don't grip the tungsten as well & require more pressure on the back cap - this causes them to reduce slightly in length but swell out the diameter - you also notice the slit is not quite straight - having a slight twist to it - once this becomes pronounced then the gas flow between the collet & torch internally is restricted - it can do it to the point no gas comes out - I figure the gap is so small to start with it does'nt take much to restrict it - but take out a heat soaked / distorted collet - replace with a new one & watch the flow meter shoot up again- the wedge collet would be an ideal solution - alternative is buy your own torch parts & swap them out when using this shared welder - take them off & keep them safe when others are using it.

Bought CK tungsten a year ago and the box were marked. made in china on the back side

Problem is I cant find those brands locally and the US freight is killing it +VAT and import toll...

I can't see why a CK wedge collet couldn't last you the rest of your life, nothing to twist, nothing to fail.

Len

Contact Keith at the Alton branch ; http://tpsweldtech.com/

They have C & K products. They should ship to you less the VAT.

Braehill wrote:I can't see why a CK wedge collet couldn't last you the rest of your life, nothing to twist, nothing to fail.

Len

The ck wedge collets, although made from a high grade copper alloy, are still softer than tungsten. That being so, they will eventually show some wear.

I didnt see until now that the CK wedge collets dont have a slot. Understand why they would last for long then.
Will try and get some when I need to refill my box.
How do they lock the tungsten?

The CK wedge collets are made of brass & hold the tungsten by virtue of an angled cut on the end - as they tighten into the collet body they are forced sideways so they in effect jam it off center to the collets hole as opposed to a regular collet trying to grip it - I have a couple of genuine ones - but they are so simple to make - in the future I will just start with some 1/4" brass bar in the lathe & make them as anything CK is hard to source & stupidly expensive here.

Well, the price of Ck wedge collets I found on a UK site yesterday is about the same as I pay for chinese no-name here

thanks for the description

noddybrian wrote:The CK wedge collets are made of brass & hold the tungsten by virtue of an angled cut on the end - as they tighten into the collet body they are forced sideways so they in effect jam it off center to the collets hole as opposed to a regular collet trying to grip it - I have a couple of genuine ones - but they are so simple to make - in the future I will just start with some 1/4" brass bar in the lathe & make them as anything CK is hard to source & stupidly expensive here.

Hi Team
Another poster on this page mentioned that the CK collets are made from high grade copper alloy.

I wonder can somebody definitively advise what the material is?

Thanks

To me the material looks like brass the color of them is yellow unlike the reddish color of the soft copper split collets. The the collets are very hard almost seems like it is made out of same metal as the CK torch heads are made.

On a side note anyone getting wedge collets for first time, when you go to adjust or remove the tungsten loosen the back cap and push the tungsten IN that will help loosing it up. If you just loosen the cap and try to pull it out sometimes it will not unlock, if you just gently push it back torwards back cap it unlocks and comes right out. I have found it is so much easier to change tungsten when welding also. With the split collets as they get hot and start to twist can be a pain inserting new tungsten in from front of torch. The wedge collets stops all that.

@trackranger,
Is there some reason that the material that a collet is made of be important? That not a slam on your question, I would like to know.

All I know is I've had the same wedge collet in my FL130 torch with a stubby lens for two years welding at 140+ amps and it's still holding. I've melted 3 of the locking nuts for the head, 1 by touching the pipe I just welded and 2 have just plain melted from the heat of the torch and the same collet is still in there doing it's job.

Technically brass is a Copper alloy and can be a high grade alloy.

Len

Braehill wrote:I can't see why a CK wedge collet couldn't last you the rest of your life, nothing to twist, nothing to fail.

Len

They do wear out. I believe the slant becomes more shallow.I'd have to find my literature on it to find out exactly but that's what I remember.

Material was only an observation on my part - I never researched it - but in my book if it looks yellow it's brass - exact alloy % unknown & yes I realize the greater proportion of it is copper - but I would only call it a copper alloy if it were still copper in color ! - high grade to me means other alloying elements ( maybe nickel / antimony etc ) to make it harder - either way I doubt there is significant wear on the wedge collet over time - but as it bears against the inside of the collet body it would'nt surprise me if it wore that instead - eventually maybe running out of thread on the back cap to apply clamp pressure - I've only recently found a supplier for CK parts here so I can't say how long they will last but I'd say they were well worth looking at - I gather if you buy the stubby kit from Wyatt he is now including them as standard - I've thus far only found full length 17 /26 size available but will make some 9 / 20 size for the stubby gas lens as they look far more durable.

Braehill wrote:@trackranger,
Is there some reason that the material that a collet is made of be important? That not a slam on your question, I would like to know.

All I know is I've had the same wedge collet in my FL130 torch with a stubby lens for two years welding at 140+ amps and it's still holding. I've melted 3 of the locking nuts for the head, 1 by touching the pipe I just welded and 2 have just plain melted from the heat of the torch and the same collet is still in there doing it's job.

Technically brass is a Copper alloy and can be a high grade alloy.

Len

Hi Len, thanks for the request.

I was purely interested because I thought I might turn a couple up to experiment with. I can see why both materials would work, although copper has better conductivity than brass, which would reduce any local heat generated at the connection. But of course copper anneals to be quite soft, and maybe for that reason brass might be the more suited material.
I do a lot of moderately heavy aluminum with 1/8 electrodes and find the copper split collets just don't last for all the reasons we already know.

Your experience with longevity from the collets is certainly encouraging, thanks for the advice.

Regards
Trevor