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Best backup material?

Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2014 5:56 am
by VooDoo
Well.. I need to do aluminum buildup (weld some holes shut, then drill and tap - sparkplug holes)

BUT what is the best material? Besides copper, dont have copper.. BUT bronze? Brass? Stainless? Mild steel? It will have 28mm wide and 100mm long "axle" in the sparkplug hole, so there is "some" mass to it. ANd it will be welded from the combustion chamber side.

Re: Best backup material?

Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2014 6:16 am
by 79jasper
Just a quick question, sparkplug hole on what?
If it's a ford triton engine, it's so common that they make a helicoil specifically for that.

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Re: Best backup material?

Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2014 6:21 am
by VooDoo
Lotus omega cyl head. SOmeone allready did use the helicoils.. And they are gone too. SO the hole is **ked up.

ANd there is some cracks in the combcustion chamber, so welding will be needed.

Re: Best backup material?

Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2014 6:44 am
by 79jasper
Ah, never mind.
All I can say, is your filler will need to be able to stand up to the constant expansion and retraction from the heat cycles.
But that's about as much help as I can give.

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Re: Best backup material?

Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2014 6:58 am
by VooDoo
4047 filler.. Done gooooood in past. No problems ever.


I think the brass or stainless would be way to go? bronze may couse problems... zinc boiling?

Re: Best backup material?

Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2014 7:35 am
by Braehill
VooDoo,
Given your choices, I'd would go with the Stainless.

Len

Re: Best backup material?

Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2014 11:20 am
by Superiorwelding
I also agree with the SS. One warning however, even though you are on a/c you can still melt or "weld" the SS so I would use as thick and big a piece as possible. Jody had a video using a thick piece of SS as a backer for alum.
Copper or brass will work as well.
-Jonathan

Re: Best backup material?

Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2014 1:36 am
by Arno
Perhaps bit left-field. but would/could a carbon/graphite rod work as well?

Might be agood idea to fit Time-Sert inserts as a final fix too. They are more robust than helicols and should give a much longer service life. ( http://www.wurth.co.uk/hand-tools/threa ... ric-coarse )

Having said that.. With such a rare cylinder head it may be useful to get a machinist involved and perhaps see if it's an option to grind out all the damage/cracks and then completely fill and re-machine the sparkplug holes?

Probably will need to bolt the head down on some form of base plate and (pre)heat and cool it gently to stop it warping.

Bye, Arno.

Re: Best backup material?

Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 9:36 am
by zank
I personally use bronze heat sinks for steel and titanium. You want to pull the heat away. Stainless does not conduct heat as efficiently as bronze or copper. The higher heat conductivity also makes it less likely that you will actually puddle the heat sink itself. Just my $0.02.

Re: Best backup material?

Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 10:39 am
by TRACKRANGER
I know you mentioned you don't have copper, but if this is an expensive component and failure is not an option, then it might be worth investing in copper to help you do the job.

Good preparation often takes more time than the job itself. Selecting and incorporating the appropriate backing material is all just part of the proper preparation process. Stainless may work, but don't expect it to pull the heat away from your weld region.

Re: Best backup material?

Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 4:19 pm
by rick9345
4 parts to brazing with Graphite

http://turnwrightmachineworks.com/2014/ ... ng-part-1/

I belive Braze wets at higher temp than Alum

could call him to ask about TIG

Re: Best backup material?

Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 9:43 am
by Rick_H
I also use a piece of bronze 95% of the time, works great.

Re: Best backup material?

Posted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 4:52 am
by VooDoo
Well.. we did make a copper backing and worked great.

BUT there is a another broblem.. Its pretty rare cylinderhead that im working on and its CRACK SENSITIVE.. tried to weld some more after part was ~only 100c temp.. Crakked after welding. It was like "stopping the weld.. ping-ping-crack" Like strait away.


SO.. IT needs heat to be welded.. but how much can i preheat cast alum?

Re: Best backup material?

Posted: Tue Nov 25, 2014 9:29 am
by Rick_H
I would pre and post heat to 350°F....them wrap it up in a blanket and let it cool very slow....

Re: Best backup material?

Posted: Wed Nov 26, 2014 3:16 pm
by VooDoo
How long postheat? hour?

Re: Best backup material?

Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2014 2:06 am
by steeldr.
any metal will work if you don't direct the arc on the backup material. The molten aluminum will not bond to any metal , its not hot enough. Weld one side ,then turn over and check for non fusion ( grind out with a carbide burr) then weld the other side and prep for drilling or milling.
I have welded several motorcycle heads using this process,and using 4043 al. filler wire with good results........Ron