Welding Tips and Tricks

I'd like to see a discussion on pricing. How do guys figure your charges. A guy brought this manifold to me. The plenum is cut open. He did that to port the inside. Now it needs to be closed up. The material is cast aluminum and its aboit 3/16 thick. Roughly 30 inches around. Claims he can get it done for $30. I tell him thats a good deal and thats where he should take it. I really thinks this WAY to much work for $30. Let me add some pics.This was cut open with a sawzall. I think I would space it with 1/16 rod to get things aligned. But this seems like too much work for $30. I'm thinking more like $100-$125.

Alumike,
There are two ways you can charge for this job. The first is T&M. Since this will mostly be time, you are making money. I think he is going with the general rule of $1.00 a inch which in some cases in not bad at all. I use this for certain production jobs and usually come out ahead but that is for jobs that sit in a fixture or are easy to assemble.
The second is to bid the job and hope you guessed correctly. This is what most customers prefer. It is easier to grasp or get a p.o. cut to you. However this is a skilled repair and if he is already complaining about the price, run. Usually these customers are never satisfied no matter what the price is.
Just my opinion.
-Jonathan

If he just wants it welded as is, I would do it for $80. If he wants it done right and I have to prep it and v groove it, I'd say $100-125.
Most people want the cheap way out so give it to them. Then tell him when it breaks to do it the right way will be X amount more.

If he says he can get it done for $30, does that mean he expects you to beat that bid with a lower price to get his business?? He's crazy. Tell him to take a hike and that you don't do shoddy work. No less than $100.

Sorry, I didn't give you a figure. $120 is what I was estimate that job for. Remember, you should do a pressure test in that manifold to make sure he would have no issues in the future. Just another thought.
-Jonathan

Wow If He can get it done for 30.00 I would tell him go for it. I would not touch it for less than a 130.00.

I charge as if it could take 3 hours of chasing porosity and interior finish work and work backwards from there. I give them a substantial discount if I breeze through it. I will make it up once they tell all of their friends, who will likely need aluminum work at some point.

Oscar wrote:If he says he can get it done for $30, does that mean he expects you to beat that bid with a lower price to get his business?? He's crazy. Tell him to take a hike and that you don't do shoddy work. No less than $100.

I had a guy ask me how much to weld something. I told him $40, as it's not worth my time to wait for someone and turn on my machine for less than that and he said he can get it done somewhere else for $10. Then why even bother if it's cheap? Does he expect me to do it for $8? I should have asked him lol

gamble wrote:

Oscar wrote:? Does he expect me to do it for $8? I should have asked him lol

exactly my point, lol.

And the cheapskate's are the ones who are never satisfied...

if he said he can get it done for $30, then if I were I would suggest to him that he take it to that other person, since he won't find anything cheaper.

You already wasted time posting here and returning to read replies. I'da had that shit done in 30-45 min and sent him on his way. $65 (/hour)minimum one hour charge for anything.

This all goes to the mentality you see on "Pawn Stars", where everything is negotiable.

I wouldn't touch that job for less than (as TamJeff said) three billable hours, and if it doesn't suck, I'll cut you a break.

"If" he really has someone who'll do it for $30, he's afraid of what he'll get for $30, or he wouldn't be asking you.

Me, personally? Pay me or go away. I don't need the practice.

Steve S

Antorcha wrote:You already wasted time posting here and returning to read replies. I'da had that shit done in 30-45 min and sent him on his way. $65 (/hour)minimum one hour charge for anything.

No you wouldn't have, because the guy can have it done for $30, not $65!

Otto Nobedder wrote: Me, personally? Pay me or go away. I don't need the practice.

Steve S

Well said. I think to sum this all up, you need to make money on this job and he has to understand this. It does not matter if you are charging $25 a hr or $120 a hr, he is going to have to pay a rate for the time taken out of your schedule to fix it for him.
Oh and go with the 3 billable hours, you can always go down on the price if you get it done sooner but you cannot go up.
-Jonathan

Otto Nobedder wrote:This all goes to the mentality you see on "Pawn Stars", where everything is negotiable.

I wouldn't touch that job for less than (as TamJeff said) three billable hours, and if it doesn't suck, I'll cut you a break.

"If" he really has someone who'll do it for $30, he's afraid of what he'll get for $30, or he wouldn't be asking you.

Me, personally? Pay me or go away. I don't need the practice.

Steve S

This. You guys are to cheap I'd tell him $200. I would expect him to walk and take it to mr. $30. I'd also let him know he's free to bring it back when it fails, but will be a minimum of $350 to repair the nonsense. I would then expect to see them back 2-3 weeks later.

Wes917 wrote:

Otto Nobedder wrote:This all goes to the mentality you see on "Pawn Stars", where everything is negotiable.

I wouldn't touch that job for less than (as TamJeff said) three billable hours, and if it doesn't suck, I'll cut you a break.

"If" he really has someone who'll do it for $30, he's afraid of what he'll get for $30, or he wouldn't be asking you.

Me, personally? Pay me or go away. I don't need the practice.

Steve S

This. You guys are to cheap I'd tell him $200. I would expect him to walk and take it to mr. $30. I'd also let him know he's free to bring it back when it fails, but will be a minimum of $350 to repair the nonsense. I would then expect to see them back 2-3 weeks later.

Wes917, does this line of thinking also apply if you are a hobbyist welder and are faced with the same dilemma? LOL

This all worked out ok. Took less than 1/2 hour. Got a fair price. The manifold is new, so almost no cleaning needed. Could have even done it faster, but I was affraid to run 1 continious bead. Had to start and stop and skip around. If I could have run 1 or 2 beads all the way around, this could have been even quicker. He brought 2 more manifolds and some head work and also is buying some parts. Even some talk of building some sheet metal manifolds. All & all, he was pleased and I have more work to do. He showed me pics of previous work and I can see why he needed another welder.
Thanks, Mike

Wait a minute, where is our picture of the repair?
-Jonathan

Superiorwelding wrote:Wait a minute, where is our picture of the repair?
-Jonathan

/\/\/\This/\/\/\

I am always real close on my figures with regard to cast or aluminum repairs in general. On dirty stuff, most customers are willing to at least share the risk. More often than not, I can improve the part or remove a design flaw in the process which makes it better than even a new, OEM replacement, that is likely to have the same issues eventually.

I usually end up charging exactly what it's worth after it's done and the customer is happy because they always expect the worst these days.

We also have to remember that we need to keep welding/repair a viable option in this age of everything disposable, or we'll end up going the way of the TV repairman.

You were wise to weld that alternately. On some thicker cast components, I will even drill a keyhole for my restarts so I don't have to concentrate heat in any one spot for too long.

Oscar wrote:

Wes917 wrote:

Otto Nobedder wrote:This all goes to the mentality you see on "Pawn Stars", where everything is negotiable.

I wouldn't touch that job for less than (as TamJeff said) three billable hours, and if it doesn't suck, I'll cut you a break.

"If" he really has someone who'll do it for $30, he's afraid of what he'll get for $30, or he wouldn't be asking you.

Me, personally? Pay me or go away. I don't need the practice.

Steve S

This. You guys are to cheap I'd tell him $200. I would expect him to walk and take it to mr. $30. I'd also let him know he's free to bring it back when it fails, but will be a minimum of $350 to repair the nonsense. I would then expect to see them back 2-3 weeks later.

Wes917, does this line of thinking also apply if you are a hobbyist welder and are faced with the same dilemma? LOL

I am basically a hobbyist now as im in an office most of the time now working on procedures etc. I do stay in practice in practice though as I still weld something everyday just in case. It is up to you to decide what you want to work for its your time. You can always knock some off a quote, but can't add on. Here I'd quote $200, if everything goes smooth and I'm done in half an hour I'd charge $100-$125

That looks to be an intake manifold for a Honda B16B or B18C5 engine. I'm thinking he is going to boost (turbocharge) the engine that, that manifold is going on. As for any fabricated manifolds whether intake or exhaust to set your price just get the engine code the manifold(s) is/are going on and do a Google search for that manifold. Say the market sets a particular manifold around $300, I'd charge at least $200. If a stainless turbo manifold goes for $600, then I'd price it around $425-475. Basically, give the customer a considerable savings in their mind. That is if your material costs don't wipe-out your profits.

I'm with the others at least three billable hours and then go from there you never know what you're going to run into some of those casts are junk.

he musta been happy with repair if you got more work!

Alumike wrote:This all worked out ok. Took less than 1/2 hour. Got a fair price. The manifold is new, so almost no cleaning needed. Could have even done it faster, but I was affraid to run 1 continious bead. Had to start and stop and skip around. If I could have run 1 or 2 beads all the way around, this could have been even quicker. He brought 2 more manifolds and some head work and also is buying some parts. Even some talk of building some sheet metal manifolds. All & all, he was pleased and I have more work to do. He showed me pics of previous work and I can see why he needed another welder.
Thanks, Mike

Why was it cut open? To be ported? Have him bring you manifolds to cut open, port and you weld them back together. that's an easy business to make money. If they are all clean.