[Otto Nobedder]

Markus made a very important point..

"- Getting a perfect color of your weld is mainly "fashion" thing. Stainless weld can be gray and it's no problem at all. "

I have emphasized this many times. Hit the weld with a wire wheel. If it shines up, you're fine; It's just surface oxidation. If it stays grey, you've overheated it and affected the alloy.

His suggestion of the single point spot weld (no filler) is a great idea for determining that your gas coverage is leak-free and pure without doing an end-to-end leak test. I'm stunned this simple solution never occurred to me, and I'll be using it.

Steve S

[Rick_H]

All those pretty colors on Instagram and Weldporn spoil everyone..lol

Markus is spot on, while color CAN be a good indicator, it is not a tell all as Steve has pointed out. I weld sanitary and it sometimes will have a duller color too it, pickles and polished up mirror finish so it is just fine.

The 16g will challenge you, it can get heat soaked quickly.

[mpete53]

Markus, I did your test looks like I have an equipment or gas problem.

The photo is done at
45 amp
25 sec post flow
#6 cup (I tried it with a #8 gas lens and got similar results)

I have tried to find leaks here is what I have done
first tank gauge still shows almost the same pressure half an hour after tank is turned off so I assume line to welder solenoid is tight

Second with a extra quick connect I have for the argon to the welder I made up a short hose and a gauge. Shut off tank, tripped solenoid so gauge showed output pressure. After 20 minutes the gauge had remained at same pressure so I am guessing all is tight to the quick connect on the machine.

Torches I have two changing them makes no difference. I have visually inspected them everything looks good as far as I can see. Is there any better way to check the torches?

Thanks again for all your help

Mark

PS grey welds clean up with small hand wire brush and shine when buffed so I guess they are usable.

[Markus]

Yup you definitely have a gas leak somewhere.
So you tested the welder for leaks and it's OK. On both sides of the solenoid, if understood correctly.

If so then there is only two options. Your both torches leaks or you have a bad bottle of argon.

What you mean by checking visually? You need a tester or soap water to check system from leaks. Otherwise it is impossible to tell results.

Do these next:

1. Check the torch for leaks while argon is flowing in it. Take soap water and spray over all joints and connections and try to look if any bubbles appear... Torch end cap, insulator, torch connection to the welder are usually places where leaks can be found.

If you can't find any leak. Then perhaps there is a leak in the torch line itself, if so you need to repair it at the local shop. However before paying anything for repairs I recommend to try my second advise below.

2. Try another bottle of argon if possible. There is sometimes bottle that contains too much moisture, which causes color and bad welds.


PS
You are able to check the torch from leaks on a pressure tester bench. Welder repairs shop usually offers these kind of services. They simply hook the torch on the pressure bottle, just like you would to the welder and then they block the torch head with special block.

[Sandow]

Threads on the torch head are either 5/16-24 or 3/8-24 depending on what you are using. Block it and hit the peddle. If there is a leak the ball will float.

Soap bubble test as mentioned works well, the only thing I'd add is that it helps to apply suds with a sponge rather than a spray bottle.

-Sandow

[mpete53]

I guess it the gas?

I took the torch apart, (end cap and all cup end fittings off) unplugged the lead from the welder (gas feed separate connection) plugged both sides of the torch head with my fingers. When I pressed the peddle the flow meter jumped up as it pressurized the lines then went to zero, so the quick connect , hose and head are gas tight.

I then reassembled and did the soapy water test. I got a few bubbles, the largest about the size of a pea after 10 seconds of gas flow. This would seem to be a very small percentage of the gas flow at 20 cfh. I then using good quality stretchy electrical tape, I taped the joint between the end cap and torch body and tried the spot test again no better.

Does this all sound like a good torch leak test? Can anyone add to what I should try?

Thanks

Mark

[exnailpounder]

You should try welding

[exnailpounder]

Nothing like giving a new welder a 40 page list of things to confuse him even more.

[Sandow]

Is it possible that you have a bad bottle of argon? Yes. Is it more likely that the problem is the tank vs something you are still doing wrong? Not really.

If you take the tank back to your supplier they'll probably swap it out for free if you tell them it is bad. If it isn't hard to do that, why not. At least you'll know one way or another.

You should try welding

Something to be said about just getting torch time and worrying about perfection later... Get so torch time on mild steel where the material is cheaper and it matters less if you have some oxygen in your shielding gas.

Just to sanity check though... You are running pure argon not 75:25 right? Those salmon color spots were with an on time of like a second right? You aren't cranking the gas flow rate way up to shield better right?

-Sandow

[mpete53]

the tank is labeled Argon. No sparks or splatter.

The last test may be a little high on the flow 20 cfh and a #6 nozzle.

My steel welds don't look that nice either.

May have a chance to get access to another tank just to check if it is the gas

If I can't, It's only an 80 cf tank, and as you all say I need the torch time so I plan to run it out

Thanks

Mark

[Markus]

Checking flow meter test wont tell anything. We are not looking massive leaks...

Where the bubbles appeared?

[Braehill]

Mark,
Any leak is a bad leak and sometimes the small leaks cause big problems as they are the ones that draw atmosphere in instead of blowing Argon out.

Another thing that needs to be looked at is your collet, if they are twisted and swollen, they restrict flow through the torch head. The best cure for this is to pick up the CK wedge collets and call it a day, they last almost forever and can't twist.

An 80cf bottle is one of the most likely candidates for moisture. They are usually bumped up to pressure off another (bank of) cylinder without ever being evacuated under a vacuum to remove moisture. If you own the cylinder and they fill it while you wait, this is almost assuredly what's happening. Get an inline moisture filter from Harbor Freight or the like and put it in the low pressure side of your system. Better yet, get a cheap vacuum pump while you're there and draw your cylinder down to vacuum overnight before you take it to be re-filled.

All that being said, I'm with the camp that says "who cares if it's not shiny". I weld quite a bit of small diameter heavy walled stainless piping and I'm here to tell you that most of it isn't shiny by the 3rd pass. Even if the weld itself is still shiny, the HAZ is definitely not. Did I overheat the pipe an inch on either side of the weld? Probably not, but it has reached a critical temperature in which it can oxidize without gas coverage. Shiny welds are achievable, but they come at a cost that most people in industry wouldn't be willing to pay. There are millions of dull stainless welds holding all manner things together all over the planet. Brush it and move on to the next weld.

Just my opinion, but if you're going for shiny, you're going to need a lot bigger Argon cylinder. It's all about gas coverage and get moving.

Len

[mpete53]

My weld polish up good enough for my needs so as long as strong and stainless.

So I guess its time to just keep welding and get better if not as shiny as I would like, welds.

Thanks

Mark

[Rituchim]

the reason u dont want gray in the weld is because u cant always tell if it wiil clean up. aim high its ok,
its what i do anyway. and in some jobs i loosen up.
jody c "somtimes good inough is better"

[Markus]

My weld polish up good enough for my needs so as long as strong and stainless.

So I guess its time to just keep welding and get better if not as shiny as I would like, welds.

Thanks

Mark

Yup,but don't forget what you have learned in this thread. Welding with contaminated gas is relevant to welding with blunt tungsten. In worst case arc wanders and no matter what you do your welds look completely awful.

Change the bottle when the time comes and check if anything chances. Also fix those leaks when you have enough spare time. After all you can't improve your skills very far if machines aren't working properly.

[Rick_H]

I just started welding Stainless today, whatcha think



In all seriousness this I welded with my Jumbo CK gas saver (1-1/8"), 1/16" tung, 60amps 2.5pps 50%/50%, travel speed is fairly quick, full penetration with a back purge. Your doing fine, lots of good guys and experience on this site that will help point you in the right direction. Practice, Practice and more practice

[mpete53]

update

I am getting better. I still can't get the hang of the higher amperage welds you all talk about so I tried lower amps and a .040 tungsten and it seems to work for me'. I well keep trying those higher amp om practice plates though.

Plate weld: 16 gauge 304 stainless, no filler metal, 35 amps .040 tungsten #8 gas lens 20 cfh and resting on a 1/4 aluminum plate

Pole: about 14 gauge 316stainless with a internal stainless sleeve. Mostly without filler, 35 amps .040 tungsten #8 gas lens 20 cfh

brackets: 1/8 x7/8 unknown stainless pins welded no filler rest with 309. 45 amp 1/16 tungsten #8 gas lens 20 cfh. not yacht grade but cleans up enough for a work boat,

Thanks for your help

Mark

[mpete53]

other photos that missed last post

Mark

[DLewis0289]

By George I think you got it! Looks good, keep burning only way is up from here.

[mpete53]

I got a new Lincoln auto darkening welding helmet. What a difference from my old harbor freight darkening. Also got the cheater lens.

I can now see the puddle and the arc clearly. Being able to see lets me get the arc much shorter creating much less heat.

Weld shown is thin walled tube to 10 gauge plate. The only post weld treatment was a light wire brushing.

Thanks again for the help

Mark

[Rick_H]

I got a new Lincoln auto darkening welding helmet. What a difference from my old harbor freight darkening. Also got the cheater lens.

I can now see the puddle and the arc clearly. Being able to see lets me get the arc much shorter creating much less heat.

Weld shown is thin walled tube to 10 gauge plate. The only post weld treatment was a light wire brushing.

Thanks again for the help

Mark

Looking better Mark, its amazing what you can do when you can see

[Poland308]

Even after having my Lincoln auto for several years. I find I I see a noticeable diferance in my quality based on how dirty I let my outer cover get.

[a6ustin]

Hello to all, what to say, this post is just what i needed, had the same problems with stainless, now i feel like i know what to do. So much knowledge here, thanks to all, saved me the re-post