[fastrip]

Hi, I was looking for any advise for the repair of a Brodix aluminum block, It's made of A-356. I have resources to heat the block, I would think 300F should be good. I have the use of a Miller syncrowave that's got a program for crappy old aluminum. I don't have the welder here so I can't give you details other than what I would assume. I would like to hear your ideas.
A friend and I used to cut 2cycle snowmobile engine cylinders apart and make performance improvements and then weld them back together. I've seem a whisky drinking hillbilly from the underground of northern Wisconsin lay dimes on these cylinders............I've seen a NASA certified welder leave nothing more than chicken shit on the same.
I have welded new aluminum, I've welded die cast small engine blocks, I've welded extra pieces to old air cooled snowmo cylinders. All of which I had pieces and parts to get things set up, I don't currently have anything of similar substance to melt around on first. Thus this message.
So, 4043 or 5356?
I have not researched the initial heat treat. I know this block will be built into a grenade, I know there are areas that are welded already, who knows whats left of the original heat treat. I just don't know about re-heat treat, ya 1000F for 4-5 hours than a dunk in near boiling water, risk more distortion, don't know that any of the fillers used will adequately be affected by the treatment.
Old school here is grind the area and fill and I have had luck with a light peen and maintaining nice heat in the whole piece. Take my time and overwhelm the lack of heat treat with mass.
Sure it could be sent to Brodix, hell can't learn anything that way, what the hell fun is that?????

Fastrip

[Oscar]

Hi, I was looking for any advise for the repair of a Brodix aluminum block, It's made of A-356. I have resources to heat the block, I would think 300F should be good. I have the use of a Miller syncrowave that's got a program for crappy old aluminum. I don't have the welder here so I can't give you details other than what I would assume. I would like to hear your ideas.
A friend and I used to cut 2cycle snowmobile engine cylinders apart and make performance improvements and then weld them back together. I've seem a whisky drinking hillbilly from the underground of northern Wisconsin lay dimes on these cylinders............I've seen a NASA certified welder leave nothing more than chicken shit on the same.
I have welded new aluminum, I've welded die cast small engine blocks, I've welded extra pieces to old air cooled snowmo cylinders. All of which I had pieces and parts to get things set up, I don't currently have anything of similar substance to melt around on first. Thus this message.
So, 4043 or 5356?
I have not researched the initial heat treat. I know this block will be built into a grenade, I know there are areas that are welded already, who knows whats left of the original heat treat. I just don't know about re-heat treat, ya 1000F for 4-5 hours than a dunk in near boiling water, risk more distortion, don't know that any of the fillers used will adequately be affected by the treatment.
Old school here is grind the area and fill and I have had luck with a light peen and maintaining nice heat in the whole piece. Take my time and overwhelm the lack of heat treat with mass.
Sure it could be sent to Brodix, hell can't learn anything that way, what the hell fun is that?????

Fastrip

According to a few online aluminum filler charts, ER4009 which is an A-357 alloy rod is designated for A-356 aluminum.

[Rick_H]

I'd call Brodix there are lots of different theories welding blocks and cylinderheads.

I've used 4043 for its crack resistance but at times 5356 for its strength, then you have the 4007 and 4009 which are made for 356.

Where did the block break? I assume from a catastrophic failure. Best thing is no matter how damaged you can usually weld them up good as new

[echosixmike]

Not Brodix, but I was involved with welding up a New Century block that chucked a rod using 4943 (not 4043) filler with 75% Helium mix. We milled out the edges square and beveled, then welded in a piece of 6061 to replace the grenaded section, as well as tying into the existing reinforcement weldments.

There absolutely will be distortion, you should hone the mains and bores, possibly the cam journal as well, depending on were the repair is. S/F.....Ken M

[fastrip]

I'm jealous, I wish I had all that equipment, Must be cool. My old Dial-arc has been a cornerstone and has served us well, taught my son how to melt in a quite respectable fashion and all that. I have a good friend with a syncrowave 250 who is just curious enough to see it done, to volunteer the equipment. Equipment I've used before.
For the record I do get to weld with a laser machine near every day, but holding .005" filler steady can be a pain, still interesting though.
The block is cracked near the crotch of one web.
I will get a 75% blend and pay attention to the pre-heat, I'm hoping to get enough heat. We have an old gas grill rig that will sit under the block and a darned smelly and heavy old fire blanket for over the top. I have 2 old hand held, corded probe pyrometers to keep track and watch the cool down. and a laser shooter for comparisons from top to bottom, front to back. Yes I will sweat, good excuse for an old fat guy to sweat besides tying his shoes or whatever..............
The eventual engine will be completely re-machined, new sleeves and all that. Still a grenade, 7 used Oliver rods and 1 new one, 7 used Mahle pistons and 1 new one and on and on. I have seen grenades like this blow up first time out and I've seen them last until they were too worn out to hurt themselves. It'll be 14.5-15 to 1 and probably be cammed for 8000rpm ish. 410 sprint car. Fuel injected, a salvaged set of -12 Brodix heads, a little baby 2.562 fuel injection. Short track motor, dry slick.
Filler, filler, filler??????????????? 4043 so the thing might successfully flex with the harmonics and dynamics or 5356 for strength to help contain harmonics and dynamics. All a crap shoot, kinda like welding old iron but unlike old iron we do know what things started out as, one time, a long long time ago and who knows how many heat cycles and repairs. I can and probably will get some 4007 and 4009, oh decisions decisions.
I need one of you guys to convince me, talk me into one or the other......what the hell, it's a grenade.....
I am going to go run the machine tomorrow on whatever I can find that might resemble a Brodix block, you know, old and oil impregnated..................

[dirtmidget33]

@fastrip I see you are located in Wisconsin. There is some great open wheel teams around you up there that could help you to make sure you get it welded correctly and machined. Look for some of the teams that run at Sun Prairie. Lot of those teams run midgets, sprints, silver crown few of them ran Indy from the beginning up into the 80s and 90s with shops equipped to do everything. I know you wanted to do it yourself so talk to them and see if they are willing to teach you proper ways. It is very common for these to be welded at some point in there life

Remember it's only a grenade if it isn't assembled correctly and properly maintained. Maintenance maintenance maintenance, After EVERY race check and adjust valves, cut open oil filter and examine it, leak test motor, check valve springs, clean nozzles, flush fuel lines if car gonna sit until next weekend, clean fuel filter, read the plugs and replace. Also don't let that fuel lay around in fuel pump or the barrel valve, clean and check fuel pressure relief valves. Make sure they opening at correct pressures and pills have no dirt in them. A stuck pressure relief valve or blockage can kill a head piston and block. If debris and bearing material found in oil filter rebuild it. If leak test shows signs of ring wear rebuild it. Valve springs getting weak replace it. All this saves money in the long run. If any one of these fail are do not work properly you can loose a motor. so after every race checking these things this will give you an evaluation if the motor has a problem and if it can be ran the next night or needs to be parked.

Did I mention maintenance

Have those rods checked before using them. Any internal rotating steel part that is used should be checked before you reuse them. Rods crank cam etc. Get those parts magnafluxed. Titanium rods have a small lifetime don't buy used (keep track of races on them and get rid of them) Yes testing and checking can cost time and money but that money spent is better than replacing a engine block later because of bad cranks and rods or sitting in the infield from a dropped cylinder.

Good luck this up coming season and SOTFG

0131161334a.jpg (43.72 KiB) Viewed 1378 times

0131161334.jpg (48.49 KiB) Viewed 1377 times

[echosixmike]

If you use helium mix, you won't need much preheat, just take the chill out with a MAPP torch or similar. That Syncro 250 will be plenty. If it's too hot to touch, it's too hot. Don't let interpass temp get too high either. You don't want to take the heat treat off the block; it's not welding cast iron.

I'm in northern IL, if you want some 4943 filler, let me know, I'll throw a lb in the mail. S/F....Ken M