Tungsten Sharpeners

DSM8 · Mon Oct 13, 2014 3:57 pm

So I have read a lot on this and there are quite a few choices out there.
MY main problem is when the tungsten gets contaminated it will not fit in the hole of my sharpener to make it easy to repoint, wanted to know what other sharpeners people have used.

I have heard about some harbor freight grinder etc that might work for the bulk removal but the biggest problem I have is getting a nice smooth point on the tungsten, depending on what diamond wheel is on the tool dictates the grind and right now it is a little too rough for clean arc starts etc.

Blaze659 · Mon Oct 13, 2014 4:57 pm

I grind mine on a bench grinder. I have a wheel for aluminum tungstons and a wheel for steel tungstons. I just spin the tungston with my fingers. I haven't had any issues. I am a new tig welder though but even my aluminum welds look good with this technique.

xwrench · Mon Oct 13, 2014 6:33 pm

I have an old electric chainsaw sharpener with a fairly fine wheel. Not sure the type of abrasive. I just chuck my tungsten in a drill and grind against the side of the saw sharpener wheel.. works ok for me.

Adam's Got Skills · Mon Oct 13, 2014 9:55 pm

I actually bought the little diamond wheel set from harbor freight a year or so ago and just found it this weekend an tried it on a drill. An even tho I don't buy much from that place I actually had good luck with it. It worked better than I thought. Really fast to...Plus I don't gotta worry about it not fitting in any sharpener. An for I'm sure less than 10$ instead of the price of a nice tungsten sharpener(300-1000$). I'm not usually a cheap skate on tools but really some of these places an 1000$ tungsten sharpeners can just get outta here wit that nonsense. I'll use a flap disc before I go that route, or better yet a 5$ wheel from harbor freight

Mon Oct 13, 2014 10:24 pm

I have never needed a $300 "sharpen" on a tungsten.

Really?

Unless you're welding Titanium blades to a turbofan...

The "sharpen" is overrated. It's better precision for a thin root, but you'll get better penetration with a blunt 90* point.

Steve S

Adam's Got Skills · Mon Oct 13, 2014 10:41 pm

An $300 is a cheap one! I'm not gonna hate on it tho...I'd like to have one, but Idk they'd have to get much cheaper or I need to make more money before I ever own one. For 2 years all I used was a flap disc...as long as u put longitudinal scratches toward the tip. An just like Otto said a longer point is precision otherwise a very short tip gets better penetration plus they don't burn back like a sharp sharp one will. If I don't get tired an dip it in the puddle I can weld with the 90degree tip all day damn near. But do to operator error it usually gets messed up after a hr or so, but have had them last all day before.

RichardH · Tue Oct 14, 2014 2:49 am

I use a common grinding wheel (aluminum oxide?) on one side of my bench grinder to get the crud off and re-shape the tip first, then hit it on a 6" 320-grit diamond wheel on the other side of the bench grinder to give it a good finish. The whole setup is dedicated to sharpening tungstens but I don't worry about cross-contamination; whatever little exists after the first wheel will get removed by the diamond wheel.

This one will last you years: http://www.mcmaster.com/#8725a81. However, it doesn't come in the standard 1/2" arbor hole, and finding a step-down bushing wasn't as easy as you'd think.

Story is, this is the setup that Lincoln uses in their training school and it holds up to a lot of use.

Cheers,
Richard

noddybrian · Tue Oct 14, 2014 3:46 am

I've not found an affordable solution for sharpening here - diamond would be the better option - if you live in the US it's easier to buy this kind of thing - Wyatt had a video a while back showing a wheel he'd come across that goes on a 6" bench grinder that seemed good . I agree that needle points are not necessary alot of the time - but surface finish has a huge effect on the Mosfet based Chinese import welders in my opinion - don't know why & when I used big old transformer machines I don't remember it having any noticeable effect.

TRACKRANGER · Tue Oct 14, 2014 9:31 am

I've only ever sharpened by hand. I thought a lot about the nifty sharpeners, and I'm sure they have their place, but you need to be able to justify. Maybe I'll get one, one day, but so far hand sharpening has always worked for me.

I saw one small hand-held job online for $1,192. Frankly, for that price, I'd expect it to also lay a perfect stack of dimes - no hands.

I saw another tungsten grinder from Denmark for a staggering $2,900 - (but I guess that the latest super-duper TIG welder and full time operator would be included - ha ha)

DSM8 · Tue Oct 14, 2014 11:07 am

Thanks for all the replies.

I have used the flap wheel with success and like I said I have something a friend of mine made that goes onto a dremel.

When using the dremel diamond wheel the finish is very nice, I have a batch of the Chinese knock off disks and they simply do not perform as well. Also since I am new to this and having to sharpen quite a bit (I have an old 350amp transformer machine that will smoke a tungsten if I get carried away) was looking at a bench mounted option for ease of use.

I think the bench grinder with diamond wheel will be the way to do what I am looking for.

Now to just find the right diamond wheel to use, I saw a post someplace where a member found one that was a direct bolt on for their grinder...time to go searching.

RichardH · Tue Oct 14, 2014 1:58 pm

noddybrian wrote:Wyatt had a video a while back showing a wheel he'd come across that goes on a 6" bench grinder that seemed good.

Yup - that's the one I linked to. I learned about it from his video. Of course, a bench grinder solution is only good when you're in the shop...

Here's the other thread with more notes and links to the video and a source for the reducing bushing: http://forum.weldingtipsandtricks.com/v ... 207#p23453

Harbor Freight also offers a small 4" diamond disc with a 1/2" arbor for $7: http://t.harborfreight.com/4-in-diamond ... 69656.html. I've been thinking about crafting a station using that along with their mini bench grinder: http://t.harborfreight.com/bench-grinde ... 43533.html

Cheers,
Richard

GreinTime · Tue Oct 14, 2014 4:57 pm

I'll have my dad post up the part number for the one Wyatt used in the video. I think he even went as far as giving the page number in the MSC or McMaster Carr catalog in addition to the part number

DSM8 · Thu Oct 23, 2014 12:19 pm

well I settled on a bench grinder with 8" wheels.

Only issue I am working on now is getting the fine wheel which has a 1" arbor hole to spin true on the 5/8 spindle the machine has.
Those plastic bushings that come with the wheel to fit smaller diameter arbors suck.
AL ones are being made asap.

I was able to do a quick test grind and the tip comes out much better that it does from my dremel style tig grinder, and OMG so much faster too.

Will have to post up a pic comparing the two. With the smoother grind and using a crayon style tip design I was getting some very nice fusion welds last night on a project i have been working on for my neighbor. Arc start was crisp and very stable a minimal pedal input.

Machine is a Sync 300HF for reference. Made in 86

AndersK · Thu Oct 23, 2014 1:10 pm

I had an unpleasant surprise yesterday sharpening a rod on my bench grinder.
Had the electric company here last week putting down a new power line to my house. Checked the compressor when they were done, motor ran in the correct direction, fine.

Started the grinder and the tungsten disintegrated as soon as I touched the wheel, wrong direction. Only found one small piece of the tungsten.

A good reminder to always wear eye protection when grinding (which I did). Tungsten isnt magnetic so if one gets a splinter in an eye the doc's will struggle to get it out.

Markus · Thu Oct 23, 2014 2:02 pm

Otto Nobedder wrote:I have never needed a $300 "sharpen" on a tungsten.

Really?

Unless you're welding Titanium blades to a turbofan...

The "sharpen" is overrated. It's better precision for a thin root, but you'll get better penetration with a blunt 90* point.

Steve S

Have you tested welding with blunt tungsten? Did it work?

There are charts that shows that blunt tungstens give more penetration etc. Well about a month ago I decided to test it by myself. Took 48.3x2.0 mm 316L pipe and ran test run with orbital closed head and with tungsten sharpened to 30 degree angle as always. Root and weld OK.
Then resharpened tungsten to 60 degree angle and welded second weld with same program. Results were hilarious

Bead wasn't straight at all and hardly any penetration.

Thu Oct 23, 2014 8:57 pm

Markus wrote:
Otto Nobedder wrote:I have never needed a $300 "sharpen" on a tungsten.

Really?

Unless you're welding Titanium blades to a turbofan...

The "sharpen" is overrated. It's better precision for a thin root, but you'll get better penetration with a blunt 90* point.

Steve S

Have you tested welding with blunt tungsten? Did it work?

I meant 90* as in sharpened to 45* to the axis, so 90* at the point. NOT simply an unsharpened tungsten (180*)

Hope this clarifies.

Steve S

RichardH · Thu Oct 23, 2014 11:39 pm

AndersK wrote:I had an unpleasant surprise yesterday sharpening a rod on my bench grinder.
Had the electric company here last week putting down a new power line to my house. Checked the compressor when they were done, motor ran in the correct direction, fine.

Started the grinder and the tungsten disintegrated as soon as I touched the wheel, wrong direction. Only found one small piece of the tungsten.

A good reminder to always wear eye protection when grinding (which I did). Tungsten isnt magnetic so if one gets a splinter in an eye the doc's will struggle to get it out.

Good advice! "What could possibly go wrong?" - famous last words.

I'm guessing your 240v power is wired hot-neutral-ground, not hot-hot-ground like the typical US residence, but how would your grinder could have started in reverse, even if the power line was wired up "backwards". I thought the design of AC motors (start capacitor) made this impossible.

AndersK · Fri Oct 24, 2014 12:56 am

Its 400V 3 phases motor. will reverse if 2 phases are switched

RichardH · Sat Oct 25, 2014 12:49 am

AndersK wrote:Its 400V 3 phases motor. will reverse if 2 phases are switched

In a house? Is this normal, or something you've ordered special?

In the US we have 240v hot-hot single-phase, which also delivers the more common 120v to neutral. But there's no hope of getting 3-phase power in a residence here.

Curious,
Richard

AndersK · Sat Oct 25, 2014 4:22 am

Thats standard here, every house has 400V 3P incoming power. Of course most appliances is on 230 single phase.

Hot Chop Shop · Tue Oct 28, 2014 12:01 am

Works great to sharpen tungsten now just need to learn to TIG weld

TRACKRANGER · Tue Oct 28, 2014 2:04 am

@Hot Chop Shop

Any more info besides the photos (brand, price, availability)?

Thanks

RichardH · Tue Oct 28, 2014 3:55 am

TRACKRANGER wrote:Any more info besides the photos (brand, price, availability)?

That's the 180-grit version of the wheel I linked to: http://www.mcmaster.com/#8725a81

I bought the 320-grit version and use it to hone the tips after they've been shaped on a regular grinding wheel. Gives a very nice finish.

TRACKRANGER · Tue Oct 28, 2014 9:28 am

@Richard:

Thanks for the heads up. The 320 grit would give a real nice finish, I imagine

Trev

DSM8 · Tue Oct 28, 2014 10:46 am

RichardH wrote:
TRACKRANGER wrote:Any more info besides the photos (brand, price, availability)?
That's the 180-grit version of the wheel I linked to: http://www.mcmaster.com/#8725a81

I bought the 320-grit version and use it to hone the tips after they've been shaped on a regular grinding wheel. Gives a very nice finish.

Where did your source the arbor adapter I have bronze ones for 1" to 5/8 but cant seem to find the right one for 1 1/4 to 5/8 which would be required by this wheel.
Can you provide your source and a picture of what the adapter your using looks like?