[rahtreelimbs]

You guys that have sucessfully welded pop cans........is there any trick to this???


I have tried this to no avail. I can weld .040 aluminum but the can thing stumps me.


I wire brush the cans and still no luck. I get a little wetness going and then my filler rod balls up and then I blow a hole in the can. This is with a sharp tungsten and at a max of 12-15 amps.


Any suggestions???

[CBPayne]

Me too. At 10amps and it blows a hole as soon as I push the pedal.

[Otto Nobedder]

I've not tried this particular weld.

After reading the weld polarity vs. tungsten size on another topic, might this be a task for DCEP TIG?

Steve S

[MinnesotaDave]

I've not tried this particular weld.

After reading the weld polarity vs. tungsten size on another topic, might this be a task for DCEP TIG?

Steve S

I been thinking of trying that on DCEP actually

Others do it on AC but I thought it would be an interesting experiment.

[Superiorwelding]

I don't know how DCEP would do on pop cans, I think it would blow through to fast but am willing to give it a shot. In have done it "successfully" once , will have to give it another go.
-Jonathan

[Bill Beauregard]

I've not tried this particular weld.

After reading the weld polarity vs. tungsten size on another topic, might this be a task for DCEP TIG?

Steve S

I been thinking of trying that on DCEP actually

Others do it on AC but I thought it would be an interesting experiment.

I'll watch to hear how it worked.
Do you find as a trait of sine wave welders that low amperage settings are all hi frequency and no low volt, amperage? With the Dialarc I had to keep bumping up amperage to form any puddle. By the time I had any heat I was at 40 amps full pedal. I ended up using .040" thoriated. Otherwise arc wanted to go laterally to the shoulder of the can instead of to the joint. Just off the joint, puddle, add filler, repeat on the other side of the joint. Go back building the blobs till you can bridge the joint. Keep the arc on the filler already deposited, pulse with pedal. With Dialarc it wasn't bad, Diversion wasn't going to work. The Dialarc was a much more manageable tool. I haven't tried with Dynasty.
I expect DCEP you'll find you have no control where on the can the arc initiates. I doubt it wants to arc from the center of the depressed joint.

[MinnesotaDave]

I'll watch to hear how it worked.
Do you find as a trait of sine wave welders that low amperage settings are all hi frequency and no low volt, amperage? With the Dialarc I had to keep bumping up amperage to form any puddle. By the time I had any heat I was at 40 amps full pedal. I ended up using .040" thoriated. Otherwise arc wanted to go laterally to the shoulder of the can instead of to the joint. Just off the joint, puddle, add filler, repeat on the other side of the joint. Go back building the blobs till you can bridge the joint. Keep the arc on the filler already deposited, pulse with pedal. With Dialarc it wasn't bad, Diversion wasn't going to work. The Dialarc was a much more manageable tool. I haven't tried with Dynasty.
I expect DCEP you'll find you have no control where on the can the arc initiates. I doubt it wants to arc from the center of the depressed joint.

I've not welded aluminum thinner than 0.060" yet so I've not experienced the condition you describe with the HF.

If I get to this during the weekend I guess I should try AC and DC+ and see if there is a clear preference either way.

And thanks for that electrical cost breakdown for the shop you sent me - very helpful

[zank]

I set my machine (Lincoln SW TIG 175) at about 25 amps (AC). I use a 3/32" 2% lanthanated tungsten ground to a fairly long point. 1/16" 5356 filler. I prep the cans by first punching a hole in one of the bottoms, let them soak in acetone for a bit, hard scrub with a SS brush, and then another rinse with acetone. I place the filler in the joint and then light up on the filler. Melt the filler and then wash it onto the can. I'm probably at about 3/4 pedal. Then I start dabbing and moving backing off the pedal as needed. The arc definitely wants to wander if I back off too much. So the key for me is run a bit hot and fast to keep the arc popping off the tip of the electrode onto the puddle rather than wandering up to the thin part of the can.


Custom aluminum tubing by Zanconato Custom Cycles, on Flickr

[zank]

As an aside, I have found similar "HF welding" as Bill describes on DC when welding very thin (<0.020") stainless. I was butt tacking up a flower with 0.018" 304 sheet, and I never really got an arc established. The HF melted the sheet enough to tack them together. And that was with a 1/16" electrode ground to a very long point.


Something for my honey by Zanconato Custom Cycles, on Flickr

[RichardH]

Me too. At 10amps and it blows a hole as soon as I push the pedal.

Depending on your welder, the HF startup amps are set separately from the main arc. On mine (Everlast 210EXT inverter), it's set in the hidden menu and it defaulted to about 35 amps. Not a problem for most welding, but was a real problem when trying to weld an 0.045" wire structure at 7amps.

As for a more general suggestion, pulsing works wonders to get/hold a puddle on thin material without it getting so hot that it blows through. Even 1-4 pulses/sec is plenty fast enough, so you could do it with a pedal.

Cheers,
Richard

[MinnesotaDave]

Zank's looks nicer than mine

Here's my first attempt with my 1963 Airco.
Low range AC (48 amps) full pedal.
1/16" thoriated, #5 cup, 16cfh, 3/32" 4043 filler rod.

Lack of nice ripples is because I started the puddle and just left the rod in it, steady torch travel, pushing in more filler as it needed it.
...and because I apparently need practice

image.jpg (41.85 KiB) Viewed 4126 times

It won't be my last try, I like a challenge now and then

I tried working with DC+ and the arc was very wide and spread out the heat more than was useful down in the joint.
I'll try it a few more times and see if I can get anything done with it on a pop can.

[gamble]

Lack of nice ripples is because I started the puddle and just left the rod in it, steady torch travel, pushing in more filler as it needed it.
...and because I apparently need practice

Lack of ripples because 3000 series aluminum is a bitch to work with.

[Bill Beauregard]

Zank's looks nicer than mine

Here's my first attempt with my 1963 Airco.
Low range AC (48 amps) full pedal.
1/16" thoriated, #5 cup, 16cfh, 3/32" 4043 filler rod.

Lack of nice ripples is because I started the puddle and just left the rod in it, steady torch travel, pushing in more filler as it needed it.
...and because I apparently need practice

image.jpg

It won't be my last try, I like a challenge now and then

I tried working with DC+ and the arc was very wide and spread out the heat more than was useful down in the joint.
I'll try it a few more times and see if I can get anything done with it on a pop can.

It looks a lot like mine with the Dialarc. I found a very small tungsten helped to avoid arc wander. I'll try the Dynasty soon.

[MinnesotaDave]

It looks a lot like mine with the Dialarc. I found a very small tungsten helped to avoid arc wander. I'll try the Dynasty soon.

Yep, switching to the 1/16" tungsten helped, but I think I could have even dropped another size.

I bet the dynasty will do very nicely

[Superiorwelding]

Lack of nice ripples is because I started the puddle and just left the rod in it, steady torch travel, pushing in more filler as it needed it.
...and because I apparently need practice

Lack of ripples because 3000 series aluminum is a bitch to work with.

Really? Guess someone forgot to tell me that.
-Jonathan

[Bill Beauregard]

Zank, you are the master!

[zank]

Nah, I just like the thin stuff. Put me on anything thicker than 3/32" and it's

[Clark Davis]

This article piqued my interest in the latest products available on the market, and I found a great resource here:http://www.directindustry.com/industria ... 79859.html
Hope this is a useful resource for you other readers.

[kiwi2wheels]

Me too. At 10amps and it blows a hole as soon as I push the pedal.

Depending on your welder, the HF startup amps are set separately from the main arc. On mine (Everlast 210EXT inverter), it's set in the hidden menu and it defaulted to about 35 amps. Not a problem for most welding, but was a real problem when trying to weld an 0.045" wire structure at 7amps.

As for a more general suggestion, pulsing works wonders to get/hold a puddle on thin material without it getting so hot that it blows through. Even 1-4 pulses/sec is plenty fast enough, so you could do it with a pedal.

Cheers,
Richard

Many thanks for that info Richard. I've been wondering why many inverters start with a current spike ( both AC and DC, and blow a f****** hole in the part ....) even with the start current setting turned off / set to zero or the electrode diameter set to minimum when that is the start current control factor and you turn it to near zero.

I hate these POS inverters !

[Oscar]

That's odd. I never heard of that. Glad to know my inverter doesn't have that.

[dirtmidget33]

Ok didn't have any real welding jobs or ideas this weekend and wanted to play with welder. So I gave this a shot. It is not a very pretty weld but they are together and the AW can holds water. The Mt. Dew can has a small pin hole it I didn't think about it until now, but when I went out to shop hit the AC mode lowered amps and got welding on these. The arc was not a very good arc cone or controllable arc however I should have adjusted frequency last thing my machine did in AC was 1/8 thick

0607142033[1].jpg (49.2 KiB) Viewed 4200 times

3/32 4043
1/16 2% lanthented
50 amps use pedal so not sure what Amps I was really welding at

[Superiorwelding]

I bought a 6 pack of Mtn Dew and when I get them down its play time.
Looks good, I am going to try 4943.
-Jonathan

[Bill Beauregard]

Zapster mentions using .035" MIG wire straightened with a drill & vise. It enables him to turn the heat lower preserving the cans.

[rahtreelimbs]

Zapster mentions using .035" MIG wire straightened with a drill & vise. It enables him to turn the heat lower preserving the cans.

Can you tell me how you straighten with a drill and vice?

[Bill Beauregard]

Cut a piece as long as your room. Clamp one end in a vice, the other in a drill. Spin until it is stiff and straight. Then cut to useable lengths.