Is it possible to weld with a liquid cooled torch with the coolant pump turned off without destroying the torch? Or, is it best to keep the pump on for even light amperage welds?
Chuck
Tig welding tips, questions, equipment, applications, instructions, techniques, tig welding machines, troubleshooting tig welding process
Charles_Karl
- Charles_Karl
-
New Member
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Sat Mar 15, 2014 2:10 am
-
Location:Fairbanks Alaska
I did it accidentally, and I freaked out when I realized it! Mainly because my equipment is brand new. I was using 60A, rule of 33, about 50-70% pedal for about 10 min, but only about 10% duty cycle per 30 seconds. Luckily my power lead does not appear to have been damaged because the water cooler was on prior to me actually welding, so the power lead was likely full of water. It's not really the torch that is in danger, it is the wire inside the power lead that carries the coolant return to the water cooler. The wire inside is much too thin to take a chance with out water/coolant.
The very next day I did a smart thing. I called up HTP and asked about buying replacement power leads to have as extras before inflation takes it's toll and everything goes up in price. Now got two extras, at today's prices. With as little as I weld, I should be good for the next ten years.
The very next day I did a smart thing. I called up HTP and asked about buying replacement power leads to have as extras before inflation takes it's toll and everything goes up in price. Now got two extras, at today's prices. With as little as I weld, I should be good for the next ten years.
Last edited by Oscar on Sat Mar 22, 2014 11:01 pm, edited 2 times in total.
- AKweldshop
-
Weldmonger
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Wed Oct 23, 2013 3:30 pm
-
Location:Palmer AK
Agreed,
Over on ww somewhere there's a thread on the topic....
General agreement is that WC torches don't have heavy enough cables/lines/head to take the heat....
Don't risk it,
~John
Over on ww somewhere there's a thread on the topic....
General agreement is that WC torches don't have heavy enough cables/lines/head to take the heat....
Don't risk it,
~John
Just a couple welders and a couple of big hammers and torches.
Men in dirty jeans built this country, while men in clean suits have destroyed it.
Trump/Carson 2016-2024
Men in dirty jeans built this country, while men in clean suits have destroyed it.
Trump/Carson 2016-2024
Charles_Karl
- Charles_Karl
-
New Member
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Sat Mar 15, 2014 2:10 am
-
Location:Fairbanks Alaska
- Otto Nobedder
-
Weldmonger
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:40 pm
-
Location:Near New Orleans
I was welding in the 250-300 amp range on a wc torch (HFAC), and accidentally pinched the supply water line under the wheel of my creeper. In less than 30 seconds, I had this on the return/power line:
And a shop full of smoke.
Note the size of the power wire, on a torch rated for 250A continuous.
Steve S
- GEDC1031.JPG (183.86 KiB) Viewed 1051 times
Note the size of the power wire, on a torch rated for 250A continuous.
Steve S
- AKweldshop
-
Weldmonger
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Wed Oct 23, 2013 3:30 pm
-
Location:Palmer AK
Steve,
That does not answer Chuck's question.
Have you ever ran a WC torch with the cooler off, even at low amperage???
~John
That does not answer Chuck's question.
Have you ever ran a WC torch with the cooler off, even at low amperage???
~John
Just a couple welders and a couple of big hammers and torches.
Men in dirty jeans built this country, while men in clean suits have destroyed it.
Trump/Carson 2016-2024
Men in dirty jeans built this country, while men in clean suits have destroyed it.
Trump/Carson 2016-2024
- Otto Nobedder
-
Weldmonger
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:40 pm
-
Location:Near New Orleans
True enough, John,
But it's a cautionary tale. It shows the small size of the power lead, and the damage that can be done should the standing water in the line begin to boil, or should it drain back and be replaced by air. I would be uncomfortable welding even low amps with the cooler off, and would have to stop and feel the return line often (at least at first) to be sure I wasn't about to cost myself money. Remember, this was less than 30 seconds (perhaps much less, I have no way to know for sure) on a 250A torch. I don't know what 3 minutes at 30A would do on, say, a 150A torch or a 90A microtorch.
I'm not sure I can come up with a good reason to have three hoses hanging off my wrist and not turn on the cooler to use them all. I have heard tales of very loud coolers, but I think I'd prefer to find a way to quiet the system if I found it too annoying while welding.
Steve S
But it's a cautionary tale. It shows the small size of the power lead, and the damage that can be done should the standing water in the line begin to boil, or should it drain back and be replaced by air. I would be uncomfortable welding even low amps with the cooler off, and would have to stop and feel the return line often (at least at first) to be sure I wasn't about to cost myself money. Remember, this was less than 30 seconds (perhaps much less, I have no way to know for sure) on a 250A torch. I don't know what 3 minutes at 30A would do on, say, a 150A torch or a 90A microtorch.
I'm not sure I can come up with a good reason to have three hoses hanging off my wrist and not turn on the cooler to use them all. I have heard tales of very loud coolers, but I think I'd prefer to find a way to quiet the system if I found it too annoying while welding.
Steve S
- Superiorwelding
-
Weldmonger
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Thu Jan 24, 2013 10:13 pm
-
Location:Eddy, TX
I have turned a syncrowave on to run literally 1.5" of weld without the cooler and that was it, with no damage. I cannot recommend this as a common practice. As Steve has shown things can go bad very fast.
my 2 cents
-Jonathan
my 2 cents
-Jonathan
Instagram- @superiorwelding/@learntotig
Twitter- @_JonathanLewis
https://www.learntotig.com
https://www.superiorweldandfab.com
https://www.youtube.com/+SuperiorWeldin ... ATHANLEWIS
Twitter- @_JonathanLewis
https://www.learntotig.com
https://www.superiorweldandfab.com
https://www.youtube.com/+SuperiorWeldin ... ATHANLEWIS
In AC it is even more critical, as you have found out. Since the torch-side of the electrical arc gets much hotter than straight polarity, I can see how that wire would easily get hot enough to boil out the water.Otto Nobedder wrote:I was welding in the 250-300 amp range on a wc torch (HFAC), and accidentally pinched the supply water line under the wheel of my creeper. In less than 30 seconds, I had this on the return/power line:GEDC1031.JPGAnd a shop full of smoke.
Note the size of the power wire, on a torch rated for 250A continuous.
Steve S
I like the "flow alarm" on my HTP Arctic Chill cooler. If you pinch the line, a loud buzzer sounds to let you know the pressure has dropped somewhere in the path. Of course when you're like me and turn it off (the whole water cooler) because the fan is freakin loud, then you might not hear it
Overall, I think there is a unanimous concession.
- AKweldshop
-
Weldmonger
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Wed Oct 23, 2013 3:30 pm
-
Location:Palmer AK
No offense intended Steve....
Just a couple welders and a couple of big hammers and torches.
Men in dirty jeans built this country, while men in clean suits have destroyed it.
Trump/Carson 2016-2024
Men in dirty jeans built this country, while men in clean suits have destroyed it.
Trump/Carson 2016-2024
- Otto Nobedder
-
Weldmonger
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:40 pm
-
Location:Near New Orleans
None taken.AKweldshop wrote:No offense intended Steve....
You were right, I didn't answer the original question. I just shared what I had.
Steve S
Charles_Karl
- Charles_Karl
-
New Member
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Sat Mar 15, 2014 2:10 am
-
Location:Fairbanks Alaska
Ouch,...point well taken. I don't mind the additional noise of the cooler,...gives me an excuse to turn Waylon up a bit. I have to be honest, being that I am use to stick welding type leads coming from a welder, when I looked at this water cooled torch, I was expecting a larger diameter lead and thought the welding supplier made a mistake. I had to look it up online to know that the lead and coolant hose were one in the same. I'm learning though.Otto Nobedder wrote:I was welding in the 250-300 amp range on a wc torch (HFAC), and accidentally pinched the supply water line under the wheel of my creeper. In less than 30 seconds, I had this on the return/power line:GEDC1031.JPGAnd a shop full of smoke.
Note the size of the power wire, on a torch rated for 250A continuous.
Steve S
"We cuttin bate, or we gonna fish?"
- AKweldshop
-
Weldmonger
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Wed Oct 23, 2013 3:30 pm
-
Location:Palmer AK
All good Steve,Otto Nobedder wrote:None taken.AKweldshop wrote:No offense intended Steve....
You were right, I didn't answer the original question. I just shared what I had.
Steve S
BTW, how were you running 280amps for 45mins with your S'Wave????
Seems like the machine would conk out before the torch, pinched hose or not....
~John
Just a couple welders and a couple of big hammers and torches.
Men in dirty jeans built this country, while men in clean suits have destroyed it.
Trump/Carson 2016-2024
Men in dirty jeans built this country, while men in clean suits have destroyed it.
Trump/Carson 2016-2024
- Otto Nobedder
-
Weldmonger
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:40 pm
-
Location:Near New Orleans
I was running 250-300A for several hours. In short bursts.AKweldshop wrote: All good Steve,
BTW, how were you running 280amps for 45mins with your S'Wave????
Seems like the machine would conk out before the torch, pinched hose or not....
~John
The SW 250 will do 250A HFAC at %40, 310A at %10.
It was winter, so the cool weather extended the duty cycle.
I'd burn two or three 1/8" rods, and stop. Drink coffee... Smoke a cigarette...
Steve S
- AKweldshop
-
Weldmonger
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Wed Oct 23, 2013 3:30 pm
-
Location:Palmer AK
Ahh,
Short bursts....
~John
Short bursts....
~John
Just a couple welders and a couple of big hammers and torches.
Men in dirty jeans built this country, while men in clean suits have destroyed it.
Trump/Carson 2016-2024
Men in dirty jeans built this country, while men in clean suits have destroyed it.
Trump/Carson 2016-2024
My 2 cents.
My Everlast 250EX has 230V power outlet on the back specificaly for the cooler. I made my cooler myself. The pump and the fan are 115v. I had to put 230\115v transformer in the cooler. The cooler is plugged in the welder and turned ON permanently. When I power up the welder the cooler turns ON automatically. I need to add an "overheat" and "low coolant" alarms to it though.
So it boils down to have the cooler hardwired to the welder's power. If the welder is ON - the cooler is ON.
My Everlast 250EX has 230V power outlet on the back specificaly for the cooler. I made my cooler myself. The pump and the fan are 115v. I had to put 230\115v transformer in the cooler. The cooler is plugged in the welder and turned ON permanently. When I power up the welder the cooler turns ON automatically. I need to add an "overheat" and "low coolant" alarms to it though.
So it boils down to have the cooler hardwired to the welder's power. If the welder is ON - the cooler is ON.
The Miller cooler on ours will stop sometimes. I am using Radnor cables at the present. I weld at 250 most days, but since I don't wear gloves, I can feel when the torch is getting unusually warm. I check the little blue water flow indicator and sure enough, it will have stopped. It does give me a couple mins warning if I am paying attention.
Miller ABP 330, Syncrowave 250, Dynasty 300 DX.
Honorary member of the Fraternity of Faded Tee Shirts.
Honorary member of the Fraternity of Faded Tee Shirts.
Return to “Tig Welding - Tig Welding Aluminum - Tig Welding Techniques - Aluminum Tig Welding”
Jump to
- Introductions & How to Use the Forum
- ↳ Welcome!
- ↳ Member Introductions
- ↳ How to Use the Forum
- ↳ Moderator Applications
- Welding Discussion
- ↳ Metal Cutting
- ↳ Tig Welding - Tig Welding Aluminum - Tig Welding Techniques - Aluminum Tig Welding
- ↳ Mig and Flux Core - gas metal arc welding & flux cored arc welding
- ↳ Stick Welding/Arc Welding - Shielded Metal Arc Welding
- ↳ Welding Forum General Shop Talk
- ↳ Welding Certification - Stick/Arc Welding, Tig Welding, Mig Welding Certification tests - Welding Tests of all kinds
- ↳ Welding Projects - Welding project Ideas - Welding project plans
- ↳ Product Reviews
- ↳ Fuel Gas Heating
- Welding Tips & Tricks
- ↳ Video Discussion
- ↳ Wish List
- Announcements & Feedback
- ↳ Forum News
- ↳ Suggestions, Feedback and Support
- Welding Marketplace
- ↳ Welding Jobs - Industrial Welding Jobs - Pipe Welding Jobs - Tig Welding Jobs
- ↳ Classifieds - Buy, Sell, Trade Used Welding Equipment
- Welding Resources
- ↳ Tradeshows, Seminars and Events
- ↳ The Welding Library
- ↳ Education Opportunities