[180proof]

If this isn't the area for this/these questions, please move them.

I'm curious as to how it's determined what ?Yr Apprentice you can come in as. Lets say I can walk in the door at the Local and whip out my 21 and 22 without breaking sweat, where would that place me? Now that's combining my 5+ years experience in the field as well, that's holding my 6G pipe cert through my contractor at the time in both stick and tig (scratch start). What would I need to do to start at a 3rd Yr +. or is that even possible? Educate me please.

What is used to gauge your progression from one level to another, etc???????

The reason for these questions is that I've talked with a couple guys about the UA V.I.P. welding program and it was laid out to me like this "if for whatever reason you (me) don't make it into the course, why not practice here at the school house then go down to the local and take each the test you know you can pass". If I did that what's the placement as far as ?Yr Apprenticeship, would/could I start as a 2nd or 3rd year?

[Poland308]

In the local I'm in you put 1 year minamum in the aprenticeship. After that you apply to the aprenticeship board for credit for previous exp. they give you credit based on the feed back from your instructors and the coordinator, based on the year you have been in class. However the pay scale for an apprentice is the minamum. If you show your worth it some employers will pay over scale. Plan on starting at the 1year aprentice pay and then if you get more it's like a bonus. Our apprentices get raises every 6 months based on hours worked and the monthly evaluations that get filled out by the journeyman they work with.

[180proof]

Ok, that is interesting info you provided. I see that as a good thing and can understand why it's that way.

As far as starting off at a certain Yr Apprentice, my understanding of how the VIP works, at least at most, a graduate will come in as a 2nd Yr with the 2nd Yr pay wage. I've talked with a few Locals just to compile a list of potential places I would like to work, so thats how I know not all will start their VIP grads at the 2yr level. Example of that is the Fairbanks AK Local, the majority of their welding is on the North Slope and on the Pipeline, so regardless of how many certs you show up with, short of the downhill, you'll start at 1st Yr App.. Then I talked to Knoxville TN and they'll start you at a 2nd Yr, Richmond VA said it would all depend on the certs obtained in the VIP but most of their VIP grads have started as 2nd Yr.. Those are just a couple that I've called, Richmond more or less left the question unanswered, but I can understand why.

Either way, I'd be stoked just to get in at any level.

[Poland308]

I think it's a grey area! The locals all leave it up to the apprenticeship committees. If you put in a good show and work hard it will reflect were they place you, and it should. I've known a few guys who even got 4 years credit. So they basically started out as a 4th year.

[180proof]

I agree with that, cause even with quality training these students are receiving, a few of them leave without any certs to show for the 18 weeks of training they just completed. Though I don't think that's the main purpose of the program, getting folks a cert or two is definitely the implied task. You're also right on the apprenticeship committee piece, the instructors here sit on or advise that board for their Local, at least that's how it sounded, and they mentioned something to that effect. But he also mentioned that only two of his grads have went to his local and only one current student had expressed some interest in trying to join it due to the proximity of his hometown. However the two that joined his Local went as 2nd Yr, but they had earned multiple certs and I believe had some experience in the craft prior to joining.

It would be nice to walk in as a 4th year, hell even a 3rd Yr. What is it that your Local requires for someone to be given a start at certain Yr? Are there certain prerequisites, checks in the box, things that have to achieve? What experiences fit a person into a certain Yr level? Is there a test or just word of mouth. Is there an Interview process for each Yr level? That's what's boggling me. I know I have rigging experience/signal experience, forklift experience, held pipe certs, held structural certs, built boilers, done heavy wall, even got tons of welder helper experience rummaging through gang boxes and finding shit like I done struck gold, lol. So what is it that gets guys in the higher Yr spots? If you don't mind, can you explain that? If you can't or would rather not, I can completely understand.

At this point, I guess we have at least one thing in common Josh, "I have more questions than answers", lol!!! If I'm getting annoying just ignore me bro, I tend to do that at times, especially when my day gets slow and the hamster wheel starts to turn.

[Poland308]

The only thing I can say I know for sure is that here they want you to do 1 year ( for lack of a beter term / probationary ) after that I know they require you to submit a formal request for concideration of having your aprenticeship shortened. I know the VIP program was started at the national leadership level. So I'm sure there may be some SOP on paper for the local committees to follow. I.E what level of pay scale to start at. But I just don't have that knowledge. I know when people who have lots of previous work experience get organized they go through kind of the same thing. Aprenticeship committe meetings are closed doors and confidential, if you ask about what goes on in the meeting you always get vague answers.

[180proof]

The "probationary" period is totally understandable and acceptable. I feel ya on the vagueness of answers about how questions are answered when asked about certain things. I've experienced that on a couple different occasions while down at the school house, but I understand that approach as well.